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Comments on: The Specter of Deflation

Posted on December 28, 2006
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Comments on The Specter of Deflation.

Best regards to all for a Happy New Year!



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308 Comments so far
  1. Breck December 28, 2006 3:32 pm

    Coincidental indeed Michael. I was just reading last night one of Prechter’s books, “Conquer the Crash: You can Survive and Prosper in a Deflationary Depression” (2002). Subtitle says it all. Of course half the book is about what Elliott Waves are (and after reading all about them I STILL don’t understand them!), but the other half is about deflation, which I do understand. So I find your essay quite timely!

  2. James December 28, 2006 3:49 pm

    Yes all this seems timely, but it seemed timely 40 years ago.In fact it has been timely for Prechter for more than 20 years..when the ‘87 drop came Prechter claimed this is it. The end of the five of five of five. He told other wavers they did not know what they were talking about when they said this is a fourth wave. since then he has sent out various interim reports stating go short immediately the sky is ready to fall. Prechter has kept his clients short for years. The losses have to be terrible for those that believed.

    Yes I too believe in principal that continual credit expansion will cause destruction …The problem is it is impossible to determine the timing. It could be another 50 years plus. In the scope of history that’s a short time, but in a lifetime it a large percentage.

  3. Uscanmexico December 28, 2006 3:51 pm

    It appears most of us are talking about Inflation or Recession. Not many are talking about the other posssibility called ‘Stagflation’.

    The problem is excessive war spending has created massive wealth across the globe and it takes time for economies/people to adjust to the excessive incomes. Extraordinary capital appreciation in stocks and real estate is making people feel wealthy. Inflation is not visible in government numbers but is clearly evident in commodities prices. Recently I was talking to my family in India. Steel prices gone up from Rs 3000 to 30000, yet no inflation. That increase in building material prices has resulted in doubling the prices of apartments which is a recent phenomena in Hyderabad, India.

    I am of the strong view that what we are experiencing is nothing but stagflation meaning higher prices and lower growth.

    How do we benefit from this? Well buying commodities stocks and commodities and US Stocks. US may gradually cut war spending out side USA. That will result in reduction in money supply for Asia. Oversold US dollar may appreciate and make every one happy. Asians continue to sell and make money by exporting to US.

    I think the ultimate disaster of gloom and doom may be postponed to 2008 and beyond.

    Please visit my webiste on commodities as uscommoditiestrader.com

  4. kia December 28, 2006 4:12 pm

    Michael, excellent article, I look forward to Part II.

    The problem is that Ben can’t hear Ludwig because he is busy warming up the fleet of helicopters to drop more useless greenbacks on to to anyone who will take them. Get out your buckets.

    Patterns of economic expansion and recession traditionally prune investment excesses. The problem is that the FED and the banking industry (Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac) have doubled the money supply and the “price” of the real estate market. Doing the math tells us that more or less the bubble is a “break even” operation while filling the asset portfolios of the banks. Don’t worry, its a virtuous circle.

    The question for me is how will these natural cycles react to this degree of “wealth creation?” My image of the credit bubble is that of a leaky balloon, where the secret is to blow enough air in to keep it inflated. If you get tired it starts to deflate until you blow more air in. The FED has an infinite amount of air, but they need someone who wants it, a borrower.

    Now it appears that up to 1/3 of the purchases made of the debt is associated with Caribbean banks, a nice euphemism for Hedge Funds run by the FED banks. Don’t you worry, because it another virtual circle.

    The problem is the FED isn’t the first Central Banks, it is the fourth. The fate of the other three were sealed by “printing of currency.” With a record like that, and the history of all fiat currencies it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to know what we are in for in the next virtuous collapse.

    Then there is the when. Markets always do what they are supposed to do, but never when. Markets have a way of punishing the majority while siphoning off a fee schedule that would make a Mafia boss blush. They’ll be smiling until the game folds.

    Physics tells us that the credit bubble will pop before expanding to infinity. I suspect we will need to coin a new word deinflastagion.

    Watch out, because if you catch this bug there doesn’t appear the FED has a vaccine. The flesh eating bacteria of the credit bubble. It’ll make the bird flu look like a pimple.

    I think I hear the helicopter hovering over the roof so I’m off to fetch my bucket.

    Happy New Year,


  5. gemstocks December 28, 2006 4:36 pm

    There will be some deflation in 2007. Real estate will go down. SUVs will go down. But unleaded regular will go up. Silver will go up. Rent will go up.

    The worst thing is food will go up. Anything that has to be shipped very far will either cost more or rot in the fields.

    We’ll have a little inflation with our deflation.

  6. SIEGFRIED GROPPE December 28, 2006 6:26 pm







  7. Michael Von Brah December 28, 2006 6:44 pm

    I believe we will witness stagflation. Sure we’ll see deflation in housing prices and SUVs. Problem is we’ll witness inflation in gas prices, food prices and in general commodities if China’s internal grow picks up.

    I frankly see no logical argument for deflation when you have the understanding that the US dollar is going much lower, Bernanke is the self-proclaimed deflation fighting power ranger, and commodities are in a long-term bull market. You can argue that making credit availability doesn’t necessarily mean liquidity will increase but there are other means for it such as continued war spending (Iran?) and overall government spending.

    Americans are a unique culture in the sense that todays generation has never experienced true hardship. You give them money and they will spend it. Saving is what your grandparents did, not us.

  8. Richard December 28, 2006 6:48 pm

    yes the deflationary collapse will occur, but it will not be apparent in a monetary sense because the amero will come out and the dual currency scam, and the ordinary person will not be able to compare the past with the present in monetary terms. And the media will tell him what to think, which of course will be psychobabble disinformation. Of course, there will be other distractions as well, more terror, scapegoating, etc. so that the ordinary person will not know who to blame for his predicament. He will blame those near to him as usual.

  9. Dave in TN December 28, 2006 7:22 pm

    I eagerly await Part II to this discussion. Please answer the following questions:

    (1) How will/can deflation work when the dollar is the currency used in international trade and is the worldwide reserve currency to the tune of a trillion+ dollars?

    (2) What happens to all the dollars if China (and others) attempt to cash in their T-Bills, Notes, and Bonds. Won’t all this paper flood the US? As such, don’t we really face hyper-inflation instead of deflation?

    (2) What effect will Iran’s shifting oil transactions to euros have?

    (3) What will happen if we attack Iran and the worldwide price of oil goes to over $100/bbl?

    (4) What will happen if/when His Fraudulency declares Martial Law?

  10. Jeff Kassel December 28, 2006 7:43 pm

    Deflation, while theoretically possible, is unlikely. What is more likely is what usually happens…the US government will try to pay their debts with devalued dollars. Since there is no real free market in currencies and since our Asian trading partners manipulate currencies by recycling trade dollars back into the United States, it is likely they will continue the game that has worked out pretty well for them. They will lend money and keep us and them afloat. At least for awhile. The alternative is too bleak.

    What is more likely is a continuation of the inflation we have been experiencing. It’s much higher than 2.6%.

    Gas, Oil, gold, nickle, iron, silver, homes, insurance and all the other things most of us have to buy. Worry more about inflation rather than deflation. Especially if the dollar drops a lot more.

    I’m more worried about an inflationary depression rather than deflation. Prices becoming unaffordable slow economies too. Deflation and inflation are always occurring. TV’s drop, but homes go up. Computers drop but medical care goes up. However, if the dollar seriously plunges, the whole world will have massive problems. China and Japan have been throwing good money after bad for years. They seem to have the stomach for it even though it is a poor investment. They want the dollar stable against their currencies. The real problem will come as the trust funds go into deficit. Part of medicare is close. But congress will probably raise the medicare tax to fix that.

    Borrowing will continue, Mike, trust me. And if you don’t believe me, show me the short positions you’ve taken. Show me your execution statements. I’ve got mine and I watched my short positions tank. It was an education.

    Don’t underestimate the people running the United States. While it doesn’t look good, the smart money seems to be betting on prosperity. The US stock market is worldwide poll. More money is going there than into gold or short positions.

    We have a real advantage economically because we have a gun to the head of big central banks. They bail us out because it’s in their interests. As long as there are lenders, we’ll be OK. The question is this: Will China and Japan be willing to finance Social Security and Medicare for the next 50 years. It is a question I put to John Sununu a few months ago in a private conversation.

    Deflation could come but inflation is much more likely. The economy has done fairly well considering what happened a few years ago. A crash in the dollar could come if China and Japan don’t lend us hundreds of billions. But right now, I think that is a low probability event. Japan and China need us as much as we need them. My hope is it doesn’t become a mutual suicide pact.

    Jeff Kassel

  11. davy December 28, 2006 8:22 pm

    The government is already printing the dollars necessary to monitize the debt, or pay off the bond holders in cash. According to Bob Prechter that will be met with a collapse in confidence, but is that necessarily so?

    The problem may unfold in more predictable fashion. Volatility in the currency markets could lead to a temporary halt in the transfer of international funds. One or more of the central banks will halt their activity until they see stability, after a period of wild fluctuations. The markets could indeed panic, but why should they? The US Treasury may agree to defend the dollar at a (much) lower level than it last traded. This would be viewed as positive. Bond sellers who panic and sell would be paid in fresh cash, which again assumes a lower value the moment it is transferred in any quantity. The foreign debt holders are screwed either way. At best the panic is contained, because some central bankers realize they are being paid off in worthless cash anyway, so why liquidate their bond holdings? Then the US reveals its plans to create a North American currency, an Amero.

    Suddenly the prospects of a trade zone in North America, and help from the Canadian and Mexican currency gives dollar bulls another boost. Gold goes through the floor. Confidence builds, the stock market tanks, but the economy starts to come around. Since deflation is a process and not an event, sorry BP, and most the damage is already done, prices start higher, but not too high, while Bernanke keeps pushing the Fed funds rate just ahead of inflation, which at the bottom goes to absolute zero.

  12. Breck December 28, 2006 8:56 pm

    Just a thought…wonder if the Chinese are going to keep everything hunky-dory until after the Summer 2008 Olympics? They wouldn’t want to put on games with America, et al. in the throes of an economic tailspin, would they? But after the Olympics, then Le Deluge!

  13. Charlie December 28, 2006 9:17 pm

    Your article is correct. The guestion is timing of events. The answer to the timing issue is the following: The US govt will continue to print money and borrow money to paper over the problems created by the bubbles as long as the US dollar does not collapse. Once the dollar starts to collapse then the printing presses and the borrowing must stop. Watch for the dollar index breaking below 80 (a 20 year support line). The dollar index is at 83.5. Thanks, Chalie

  14. Simon December 28, 2006 9:38 pm

    It is clear the early warning signs of the possibility of a deflationary environment began to show up early in October 2001. The only question is whether or not it will become severe enough to generate the kind of massive deflationary downturn that occurred in the 1930s. Most everyone, including the financial media, are unaware of the signs. They’re so focused on the day to day movements of the stock markets that they’re oblivious to the warning signs. But Ben knows. That was a great trick he pulled!

    Keep your eye on the velocity of money. It takes more and more debt to produce growth…

    It is not just the home sellers that are lowering prices. The big 3 auto makers are, and computer companies, too…Looks like the shoping season wasn’t that great, either.

    But like your article says, it is just a specter, for now. Lets see what other tricks they’ve got up their sleeves.


  15. Mish December 28, 2006 9:39 pm

    Extremely well written.
    Much appreciated.
    I will pass along

  16. tooth fairy December 28, 2006 10:02 pm

    It would be ironic if deflation were actually to occur, but I don’t think that will happen with a worthless currency. Stagflation seems more likely to me. Housing, no doubt, will deflate, but everything else will go up in price is my guess.

  17. Black Maribuzo December 28, 2006 10:39 pm

    When all other answers have failed, then the truth lies in the only remaining solution, no matter how absurd it may seem.

    There must be a much greater conspiracy by the government to manipulate the value of the dollar, thus gold, thus inflation.

    The “Inflation” gauge is, after all, how the government pays its bills. Government payments are all tagged to the official inflation rate. (Right…)

    How is it possible, I wonder, that these brilliant men- MIT, Harvard, Yale- cannot see the deleterious effects of creating so much money? Everyone knows that the easy money has been pumped out for so long that the world is literally awash with dollars.
    Therefore, there must be some globalist vision; some idea that having a weakened currency will spread the wealth against other, lesser currencies. The obvious effect here is that the US dollar gets more “in-line” with other currencies.
    Is that the beginning of the end-game for a single world dollar? Will they call it the Terra?
    Why am I forced to ask these insane questions?

    I cannot imagine why dollar deflation would be an advantage to the US, but there is no other plausible answer as to why the Federal Reserve has loaned so much money into existence. Paulson says he believes in a strong dollar. Are they trying to start an economic war of words and deeds with the Chinese?
    Why loan so much money? If only to keep it going, as von Mises projects? With no way out- no light at the end of the tunnel, no way to prevent the inevitable, it seems to me that the last thing one would do if driving over a cliff is punch the gas.
    There are reports that the Fed loans may be being used to purchase S&P futures to support the stock market! Perhaps there is a fear that if the US stock market were to take a hard hit, then credit would dry up, defaults would pour in in droves and our “gangbusters” economy would grind to a screeching halt. Is that how and why the Fed is supporting the stock markets? Is it another crazy question?

    All the ideas you expressed in your article were well thought out and eloquent to the blue-collar guy. I can appreciate that. My only question has been and still remains, why would these bright men continue in an operation that they had to know was faulty at least and disastrous at worst? I can imagine in my head the ramifications of these policies but still for the life of me understand why they keep creating money month after month.

    I, too, lost a lot of money in short positions. I have watched as the market has done some amazing things over these past few months of 2006. Incredible things, indeed. Scratching my head, I can only wonder whether this is Ben Bernanke’s task, too. Or is the world so full of money that people just throw dollars at a stock market that refuses to correct?
    Truly, we are approaching one of the most turbulent times in American economic history. Just the coming story of the dollar alone will be quite an education for future stockpickers and options players.

    I just wish all this made some semblance of sense.

    Black Maribuzo
    Thank you for the opportunity to comment.

  18. domo December 29, 2006 12:13 am

    when the financial markets go down, like a big time version of may06, will force ious and margin calls to come due. the resulting panic and collapse will destroy extreemly leveredged hedge funds and derivatives. the credit system will be devestated. this will be the start of the deflationary crash.

  19. Henry December 29, 2006 12:41 am

    Really great article. Bernanke next to Mises was hilarious. We’re screwed. They’re inflating to steal wealth, and will introduce the Amero after the collapse. Remember, you heard it here first…on an anonymous blog comment.

  20. Marc Authier December 29, 2006 1:10 am

    Funny way of having deflation ?

    On january 1st 2007 the price of milk in Québec is going up 7 cents! Milk. That makes a 4% increase. I don’t believe in deflation because central bankers and politicians want and need inflation at all cost. It’s the only way that governments and big business can erase their debts and litterally liquidate the stupid creditors that buy their worthless paper called bonds. Expect even more inflation and never mind the noise of expected deflation. Remember the nickname of Bernanké? “Helicopter Ben”

  21. Eddy December 29, 2006 4:00 am

    The Piper is wanting to be paid and soon.

  22. nestor December 29, 2006 5:15 am

    Please. Talk of deflation in the US economy is stupid. Prechter is a moron. He’s always wrong. Inflation is rampant right now in the US. It’s just not being measure properly. Quality adjustments and owners’ equivalent rent in the CPI numbers are bullsh!t. Inflation is currently running at 6-8%.

    Talk of a strong dollar by US authorities is a joke. They don’t WANT a strong dollar. It’s not in their interests. The only way to solve the US debt problems is INFLATE. The treasury CAN PRINT as many dollars as it wants if it has to, and it WILL.

    Inflation is rampant. Prechter is a moron.

  23. vsiwsbhi December 29, 2006 5:20 am



  24. Bob December 29, 2006 6:24 am


    Let us not ignore history’s repeated lesson where all government paper fiat has always returned to its true intrinsic value - nothing, nada, zilch, doughnut hole, 3/5 of 5/8 of sweet FA !

    Read this latest article from FSU;


  25. muleskinner December 29, 2006 7:13 am

    $1.99 for apples is too much money. I won’t pay a dollar a pound for apples. The free apples are the best apples.

    Even the apples know that.

    Digital manometers are the dumbest product I’ve ever seen for sale. Who needs a digital manometer.

    Real estate taxes have more than doubled over the last twenty years. So has the price of gasoline.

    From 1970 to 1990, the price of petrol quadrupled. From 1990 to 2006, it has doubled.

    The situation is improving.

    Inflation has been reduced by half, so, you see, there really is no need to worry.

    Everything is under control.

    It’s as lame and hapless as it gets.

    I say Bush is a bigger moron than Prechter, hands down.

  26. kia December 29, 2006 7:58 am

    Dave (#9)

    If you look at the history of fiat currencies the cycle is something like this:

    Inflation->Deflation->Hyperinflation->Martial Law

    Bob (#25) good article, thanks

  27. Christopher December 29, 2006 7:59 am

    In regards to the following I have a contrary viewpoint from personal experience.

    “Banks need to sell those properties! Quick! One article estimates that 25% of all pre-owned homes on the market in Dallas are forclosures! This puts incredible downward pressure on prices because banks are the definition of “motivated sellers.” ”

    I think the Fed has a trick up its sleeve to eliminate this type of deflationary problem. I was renting a brand new high-rise condo in Houston. It was sold to an investment company and my lease was transferred. I was paying rent to the investment company, but they had flipped the property to someone else - someone unknown to anybody - most likely was identity theft. No payments were ever made on the high-rise condo, it was repossed, and I was forced to move.

    So, what happened to the repossed condo?

    According to the realtor that told me the property was reposed and I had to move, the Bank immediately got rid of it - by giving it to Fannie Mae - a government agency - with lots of money - and no incentive to sell the property whatsoever. The property is still listed at full list price and does is not even listed as a foreclosure. From what I understand, Fannie Mae then takes these foreclosed bad loans and packages them and sells them to hedge funds.

    So, this is one trick the Fed is using to defer deflation.

  28. Brian Nelson December 29, 2006 8:26 am

    The phenomenon of monetary expansion is not new. Previous governments knew that they could only venture but so far down this waterway because as in the movie “African Queen”, Bogart and Hepburn, the river adroitly changes so much so that the lower portion is not even recognized by the same name, Bora Bora. Such is the nature of inflation/deflation, opposite sides of the same coin. Most sensible governments used a “canary in the mine” approach, if the canary died it was time to leave the mine quickly. The canary was gold. When citizens redeemed their paper currency in gold governments knew that they were printing too much currency. Because of the limited supply of gold, the government cache of gold would soon be depleted if they persisted with inflationary policies. The credit factor being expanded using “the everyone is equally reliable fallacy” has further overloaded a system relying on the checks and balances of man’s disappearing honesty and integrity. The bottom line is that even with the most blatant of shenanigans sponsored by either corporate or governmental interests, there are only so many good investments available at a given time. The beauty of course is in the eye of the beholder. After the good investment positions are taken, severe RISK enters the picture and no amount of safeguards will enable the system to inflate further, cascading failures will occur and even government bailouts will not prevent the inevitable transition of inflation to deflation.

  29. pater tenebrarum December 29, 2006 8:58 am

    the Fed can in theory ALWAYS create inflation - however, it would need to modify its modus operandi to do so, and it is highly doubtful that it would do so in time or at all (also, this would lead to unforeseen consequences, as such interventions always do).
    to explain: there is nothing that keeps the Fed from e.g. monetizing defaulted loans. it could also, literally, begin to drop money from helicopters. these methods would get around the problem of the horse not wanting to drink.
    however, this would also end up in the destruction of the entire currency system, and this is why they are highly unlikely to do it, as the end result would be a loss of power for the Federal Reserve. it seems far more likely that any untraditional methods would focus on ‘quantitative easing’ a la the BoJ, and the large scale monetization of government debt in conjunction with a huge deficit spending spree. in short, the Keynesian recipe, which has failed spectacularly every time it has been tried, would be applied in spades. this would unnecessarily lengthen and deepen the deflationary contraction by keeping malinvested capital on artificial life support, but they would of course do it anyway (as can be shown via his writings and speeches, Bernanke is essentially a monetary crank - his professed belief in the printing presses magical powers more than confirms this).

  30. Joe December 29, 2006 9:35 am

    Hello Michael,

    I’ve read your article on deflation as well as Prechter’s book. I’m inclined to believe that portion of Von Mises’ quote that was not reported in the article. That is a bust in inevitable after a liquidity-induced boom. However it can happen either as deflation in a free-market economy (read gold standard), or later as the utter destruction of the underlying currency in a rigged market (fiat currency). I believe the second scenario is what awaits us. The Plunge Protection team (US government), the central banks of the world -that are awash in dollar denominated assets-, and wall street will make sure that said destruction occurs in a slow, subtle, imperceptible way which will allow the money powers to shift the currency risk and the burden of investment loss to an unaware and unsuspecting public, nationally and internationally. Also, the progressive devaluation of the dollar has a plurality of purposes - government debt management, trade deficit management, and eventually the ultimate short-term goal of the globalist agenda, the introduction of the new northamerican fiat currency: the AMERO. Sincerely, I enjoyed your article.

  31. Bob B December 29, 2006 10:18 am

    Of course all fiat currencies are inherently flawed and must fail in some manner.

    Until then the deflationists should not underestimate the ability of governments to inflate. When people cut back on borrowing because of fear of being unable to repay, the government will step in and borrow on their behalf. This will be given to the citizens as a gift. While people may not borrow, who could refuse a gift of free money.

    I notice in the news today that our own socialist government in Canada has discovered a new class of people to whom they have to give money. Apparently “millions of Canadians with moderate disabilities and illnesses do not have income support”.

    In my less generous moments I think the goal of most governments is to steal the wealth of the country and then give it away in a manner to control its citizens.

  32. Alan McCaig December 29, 2006 10:47 am

    Some one is telling ‘Porkies’..!!
    A little over a year ago I wrote a note concerning debt and included a comment about the ‘World War 11 war Debts. I believe I said it was all paid up and done by 1987. It seems I was wrong as the big announcement on this side of the pond is, that it will ‘officially’ be paid off on the 31st Dec 2006. Occording my, and my old friend in England’s recollection, George Brown the long-time and only Chancellor of the Exchequer since Labour came to power, claimed it was ‘all paid in full’ 15 years ago.
    So it is a bit confusing is’nt it…??
    So I searched the internet for this report to send to him because it had not yet been mentioned in their News programmes. I sensed he thought it was ‘rag’ news and not true. I have copied this email and invite you to read the articles pasted. Wars create lots of debt but the content of both items I found quite startling:-

    “I am searching for ‘written’ info and am coming up with other interesting stuff in the process. See this one below from WW 1 re the French war debt. Dated from 1925. It gives you an idea of the huge cost of the first world war and connects to the present time. Certainly food for thought.
    Well I have found the current North American headline & article regarding Britains WW 11 final war debt payment to take place Dec 31st 2006.
    Sounds like ‘Georgie & Tony’ told a naughty story 15 years ago?? It is quite clear & detailed. Canada gets it’s money too.

    Alan McCaig
    Nova Scotia Canada
    (Cockney rhyming slang. A clue for you. “Pork Pies”..?)

  33. the stranger December 29, 2006 11:54 am

    Incredible; it really is that simple. Excellent distilled reasoning Michael, did some readers miss it? The Specter of Deflation; a specter isn’t real…

    Though Bernanke never admits to it in his speech, the unspeakable "it" is more than just deflation, but the very "final collapse" that that Mises warns of.

    They will fight, they are fighting, the final collapse. They have no choice; and inflation to hyperinflation is just a process from the tools at their disposal, steps toward collapse. It’s not that they are going to give it more gas as we race toward the cliff; the accelerator is stuck, and hitting the brakes in mid air is just tragic comedy. The Fed won’t keep this going because it is in their self interest; it’s not possible. And I’m sure the owners of the Fed will do just fine after the collapse.

    The juxtaposition of Mises and Bernanke is great reminder; being in charge isn’t the same as being in control.

  34. ESPMan December 29, 2006 12:16 pm

    There is no deflation. There will be increasing deflation buzz, this buzz is plotted to give the fed an excuse to lower the rate. That is what all of this deflation buzz is about. There is no deflation, we are on the verge of a hyper-inflationary world market as supply-demand inbalances will cause those who hold dollars and euro’s to begin hoarding raw materials. The monetary policy of the fed has not been one of tightening, the interst rate rises are a sham, the money supply grew at over 10 percent in 2006. Credit is being injected by the stellar ton, there is no deflation.

  35. Rich December 29, 2006 12:16 pm

    Ben is in place because he has studied the past. The Fed has been in existence since 1913, the First Great Depression was 70 years ago, and the Fed was less than 20 years old when it started. That Depression didn’t end until after WW II.

    Bretton Woods was created in ‘43 to manage the post war global financial system. The UN was created at the same time, followed by the IMF and World Bank, to control aspects of globalization. That is over 60 years ago now.

    My point in bringing this up is that clearly the Fed understands history, they create history, you could say for now they control history. I doubt they are particularly scared by current events, they’ve been through it before and survived and grown in strength.

    From assuming control of the US treasury in 1913 the Fed effectively took control of the western worlds central banking infrastructure post 1945, as well as Japan. Now they have a shot at running the entire planet, but they need to reset the system. Just how this gets wound up is of obvious interest to us sheeple, do we survive, do our families make it through the great default and it’s aftermath, what does the Second Great Depression look like, and is it avoidable?!

    One thing is for sure, the owners of the Fed will survive through almost any major upheaval. Chances are they will maintain their control for some considerable time to come.

    As for references to Alchemy, check this out, I think it is pretty fascinating:


    Inflation, deflation, stagflation, masturbation, constipation, annihilation, all we are singing is give peace a chance!

    Gotta run, cheers Rich

  36. Brian Nelson December 29, 2006 1:34 pm

    To ESP Man, Deflation, ultimately is the failure of capital to pay debt. Think of the 1930’s, Bernanke aside, the government could not entice people to incur debt because their confidence was shattered. Inflation and deflation can exist simultaneously, the dictating factor is supply. For autos, computers, flat-screened tv’s prices will fall because of global competition and unlimited supply. At the same time: precious and industrial metals, oil, natural gas, potable water will increase in price because of limited supply and increasing population demands. Hyperinflation is extremely close to deflation in that if the monetary system is not overhauled quickly, it will thoroughly undermine the entire existing financial system. Can you really envision people pushing wheelbarrows full of money thru downtown L.A.? When hyperinflation hits don’t even try to get into a coin dealer’s shop. Remember $50 silver. Think 100 X $50 silver.

  37. GLO December 29, 2006 3:10 pm


    Great article, but there are other options. Credit is not the only option for delivery of “money” into the system. For example, How about if the the Fed decides to “pay off” all our mortgages by electronically printing money. The debtors are no longer in debt and now have some monthly free cash flow to spend. The creditors are whole and now have tons of cash for “investment”. Sure asset prices zoom but for as long as I know that has been defined as a good thing. Practically speaking it’s not much different than what teh Fed has done over the last ten years only faster. This may sound extreme but heck where the Fed has led us too is an extreme place. Desperate times will call for desperate measures.

  38. tolonaro December 29, 2006 5:46 pm

    Appreciated the article. Feels though like the option to destroy the currency is the one the Fed will pick. Think Weimar.

    There are several benefits to the government of a destroyed currency, the biggest being the ability to abandon the entitlements legislations. (What $40 trillion dollar debt? we paid it off!). While I am for a North American Union (under our constitution!), only in the last month have I heard of them amero. The idea of creating a new currency sounds ideal as a mask for the destruction of the old.

    What this implies is that the deflation may be put off a bit, but this is unstable country. When life gets troubled, people as a whole will stop borrowing, period. And then stop buying, while they save up the money to purchase again. Then deflation kicks in no matter what you try to do. Of course, if they can combine that with the amero, maybe the mask will hide what is happening?!

    The problem is: If there is hyperinflation coming, I should borrow to the limit and then use my inflated dollars to pay it off, thus “enriching” myself. But if there is deflation coming, I should get rid of all debts and hold “cash” (gold or whatever).

    But the more I see the Fed operating, the more I see hyperinflation quickly before the deflationary crash.

  39. larry December 29, 2006 5:51 pm

    good ideas…my thinking is that peoples salaries are not keeping pace with the dollar devaluation…so,things that people buy,like homes will be less afordable…so,i think that inflation leads to deflation of some asset classes….people will be severly more squeezed in terms of dicretionary purchases….i can see no good coming from years of currency devaluation…..i saw an other post referring to AYN RAND,she calls these monetarists the ‘great destroyers’ in their undermining of currency and the value of regular folks labors…cruel and insideous inflation with deflation in discretionary purchases and great civil strife…..i am scaring myself again…i learn a lot from all of you…you have to hear this stuff from all kinds of angles to get it….that is the point,no?…real smart people making it impossible to understand a basic thing called money..their power comes from deciet and that defines evil…i’ll bet allen greenspan has been loading up on gold ,huh?

  40. Reinhard December 29, 2006 8:10 pm

    It was a great article, but I echo the comments #28, #30, #31, #32, and #38, (especially #30!), that money can be created to some extent to counter the deflationary shrinking of debt. This just by the Fed buying government debt that is never paid back. Therefore, more dollars are irreversibly in circulation, reducing their value forever. What’s the evidence? Any country not on a gold standard I suppose, and even the U.S. since 1971. Could you imagine that all credit created since 1971 could dissappear and we are back to 1971 prices? That’s ridiculous, there are already more dollars around than just credit. So, if the government went on this path of inflation, they can also continue it as far as they can go. Of course, there can be phases of slight moderation or even slight deflation, e.g. if a guy like Volker comes again, or if gold and oil rise dramatically while credit shrinks. Or if the dollar and long-term bonds crack. But betting on deflation that totally reverses the prior inflation seems a lower probability outcome.
    One could call it deflation-in-gold-terms, sure, with the same side-effects as the real deflation: lower stock and asset prices compared to gold, unemployment from the malinvestments during the reckless credit creation. Some misery, but the government will ultimately decide who will share the misery.

  41. Breck December 29, 2006 9:01 pm

    Well I think the following dialogue between these two fellows is very relevant:

    “JIM: Finally, before I let you go, I did get an e-mail from a follower, his name’s Richard. He wanted to ask you, in terms of your thoughts on how the Fed money expansion will impact this deflationary view. He cites others, such as James Sinclair, Marc Faber, who believe that as long as the Fed is printing money, that money will find its way into somewhere. I wonder if you might comment on that. If that money is going out of the economy due to collapsing debt, will it overwhelm the money being forced into the system by the Fed?

    IAN: I think absolutely it will. We’ve got 32 trillion dollars of debt — most of which has to be cleansed from the economy. Not only do we have that, but we have a stock market bubble. We’ve lost 7 trillion dollars in the stock market. Those are real losses. People have lost that money. We also have a real estate bubble that has yet to, I believe, deliver a loss and a large loss. So with those losses, it’s absolutely impossible for the Federal Reserve to print money fast enough to overcome those kinds of losses. The other thing that you have to do, the Federal Reserve can print all the money it wants, it goes into the banking system and the banks have to want to lend it and the borrowers have to want to borrow it. So if that doesn’t happen, and I don’t believe it can happen, then there’s no way that we can have inflation. I truly believe that with that huge amount of debt that overhangs the economy at this stage and only the beginnings of the unraveling of that debt, that debt is deflationary and therefore we are going into deflation, not inflation. The period in the Kondratieff Cycle for inflation is the Summer. The period for deflation in the Kondratieff Cycle is the Winter.”

    Jim Puplava and Ian Gordon are the questioner and responder respectively. The whole interview of Gordon is very good, albeit a bit dated, but since most of it is about the K-cycle, it is helpful too. Go to http://www.financialsense.com/transcriptions/Gordon.htm

  42. ESPMan December 29, 2006 9:49 pm

    Americans will only shy away from credit debt for so long. As they become more financially sensible and pay off debt while refusing to take on more debt, they will be susceptable once agian to the marketing pressures of the American society. The American consumer has proven time and time again that when confidence is rising, they are more than willing to go back into debt to get the things they want. It will be so once again as the deflation buzz you are buying into will give the fed good reason to lower rates and create the perception that times are good and easy money abounds. The inflation will be supplied from our overseas suppliers raising the amount of dollars they want in exchange for their goods. It will develop into rampant and zig zagging inflation but then, the fed will not be able to reign it in and they will let the dollar continue to plunge in order to set up the new hemispheric order with a new metals backed currency. The currency will be backed by more than one metal. It is only in this way that they will be able to reset the monetary time line back one hundred years so they can start to entire cycle all over again. Of course, the best laid plans of mice and men are often dashed by social upheaval and acts of war. It all remains to be seen and since it is highly dependent on political forces to make it work, the publics level of good faith in politicians can make or break the plan. The next round of high inflation will be the last. We will never see any real deflation, the fed and central bankers will kill the dollar and give birth to the Amero before that happens.

  43. Reinhard December 29, 2006 11:28 pm

    In response to #42: Yes, I am also always thinking if the huge debt can deflate faster than new money can be created, so you might get a little deflationary hiccup. But there really are not many limits as to the government creating money. Any law to bail out debtors, failing lenders, corporations, etc. would do it, or like #28 describes. As far as people not taking on debt, this is unlikely since one has to. If they slash rates to 1%, there is only one way to preserve your buying power: Borrow money and buy hard assets. With the borrowed money you can pay the fake capital gains taxes. From this follows the real limit of inflation: When people refuse to buy consumer products, and start buying gold and hard assets. And when retirees go and protest against devaluing their savings. That would force the government to stop the printing presses. But so far no sign of these events happening.

  44. Rich December 30, 2006 12:38 am

    What are the effects on deflation and inflation of approximately $400 Trillion in off-balance sheet derivatives?

    Surely we are in unknowable territory here.

    Fundamentals are meaningless at this point.

    The power to obfuscate is more important than the power to create credit.

    Alchemy is truly the state of modern monetary management.

    Cheers Rich

  45. domo December 30, 2006 2:16 am

    one thing that those expecting the fed (and every other central bank?) to bail out a deflation of credit forget: economists and governments have a very consistant history of firmly predicting “the worst is over” at the start of any new trend (ie this has been going on with the houseing collapse for several months already). Ontop of that psycology of denial is that the government normally only take regulatory action after the fact making the situation worse, not better. Ben berbanke seems to be aware of credit deflation, or is he? was his speech at the height of the deflation scare a reation and a denial itself of the deflation threat “making sure it doesn’t happen here”, and why the lack of intervention in real estate now, to bail out homeowners who threaten the whole economy with collapse?

  46. Makia December 30, 2006 6:40 am

    First i apologize i haven’t gotten through many of these posts so i’m sorry if i’m being redundant.

    Generally my M.O. is to find the essence of an issue, rather than analyze nooks and cranies and attempt to prognosticate with accuracy. Generally understanding the essence of the issue is more valuable in terms of predicting outcomes with the least amount of stress. Not always the most useful approach depending on priorities, but overall comprehending the essense can be very valuable. To wit, i read something recently that stands out regarding the inflation/deflation debate. Paraphrasing: “The thing that we need become much more expensive while non-neccesities deflate.” I beleive larry pointed out another very salient point

    . . .peoples salaries are not keeping pace with the dollar devaluation…so,things that people buy,like homes will be less afordable…so,i think that inflation leads to deflation of some asset classes. . .

    My only other point, and sorry again if i’m preaching to the choir:

    When i speak of inflation i am careful to differentiate with my language by labeling “monetary” inflation and “price” inflation. They are very different and when speaking to the educated and the uneducated alike, very few people have a grasp of the difference. Obviously, what we _feel_ is price inflation, but the far greater issue and cause of the problem is “monetary” inflation. IMO, it is EXTREMELY important that one (the investor, the retiree, the lay-man, the voter, and the citizen) understands this before engaging in any kind of meaningful speculation, understanding, and planning. The problems on the rise and the causes are quite a bit more significant that the rising cost of bread, gas, or plasma tvs. (Plasma tvs in this case would reduce in price to the extent that the cost of production and shipping doesn’t affect the price)


  47. the stranger December 30, 2006 9:03 am

    No one can sum up economics in a single essay. Not Fekete, Mises, Rothbard, etc. and it is with this fact in mind that I think Michael’s article is particularly brilliant. It is the gist of the article that draws you back to basics. An analogous ending could have been, who you gonna trust, Einstein or any sitting president?

    Michael writes, “The Fed and the Treasury - the central powers of Capitalism itself…” and I could counter with, “the Fed and the Treasury relationship are more like Communism than Capitalism.” But I think Michael would agree with my statement, plus I knew exactly what he meant, so I didn’t get bogged down in that perspective. (yes, I’m going somewhere with this)

    Mises is speaking to the mechanics of inflation. In this day and age we should be able to apply his term “credit” to more than just housing loans for example. I mean, credit and debt are just opposite sides of the same fiat coin. Nothing backs the FRN; it’s all debt. And these mountains of derivatives are more like credit than stacks of silver dimes.

    And you don’t have to loan all money into existence; the counterfeiter doesn’t. By the way, Federal Reserve Notes are counterfeit by definition. They were made to look like honest notes. At a glance they are almost identical to the notes they copied; the originals of course being gold and silver certificates. Our coins are counterfeit as well. They would have been cheaper to produce if they didn’t coat the outside with silver. And the edge of your dimes and quarters, the corrugation was there to keep people from scraping the edge of several coins to steal a little pile of silver.

    So I don’t know what they will do in the next bubble collapse. From what I understand, they can create fiat at damn near the speed of light.

    I use the terms monetary-inflation and price-inflation, but I don’t like them. The former is redundant and the later an oxymoron. Prices rise and fall; they are linear, two dimensional; inflation is three dimensional. The term inflation has been subverted over time to obscure simplicity. 

    Here’s the kicker, the law of supply and demand applies to real things. History provides examples of the money supply inflating due to massive increases of gold or silver. Reducing the quantity of Federal Reserve Notes, in the end, may do nothing to increase their value; they have no value. It’s a con – The Biggest Con.

  48. Makia December 30, 2006 9:30 am

    Great shit stranger. Sometimes the stranger is truer than fiction.

    I kill me sometimes. . .

  49. the stranger December 30, 2006 9:45 am

    Monetary inflation; actually the term is more superfluous than redundant. I think we have an interesting and dangerous year ahead. I still hope for the best though.

    …Happy New Year and Salutations to all!

  50. Makia December 30, 2006 10:16 am

    Well stranger, i still stand by my comments. In my post i am pointing to (in addition to my pursuit of clarity) the difference between most people’s view of inflation (prices going up), and the - for lack of a better thought - “actual” inflation that causes prices to go up (beyond sound money influences of supply & demand), i.e., “monetary” inflation, i.e., inflating the money supply. Most folks, from my perspective, have no idea why the FR would print more money than should be dictated by supply/demand, or WAY more money than sound money principals would suggest for that matter.
    Of course the elephant in the room is making obligations that aren’t properly financed (so you just print out more money), and the manipulation of interest rates by forces other than the invisible hand, and the fact that, in the end, as stranger puts so succinctly, the notes have no intrinsic value. Perhaps (likely) the last point is the most relevant and simultaneously hardest for modern man to (consciously) accept.

    Also, government is a big problem, and i have no idea how it can be made to actually serve the common good (because choices are made by people, not by laws). This is another elephant in the room.

    This room is cramped.

    Have a good one!

  51. larry December 30, 2006 10:35 am

    makia…you quoted me?…i now can die in peace!…i really share all your concerns..it does grind on me just how manipulated we ALL are…my thing is healthcare…small potatoes compared to the activities of the federal reserve board…but,the principle is the same….the medical hegemony depends on baffling the public with bullshit to maintain control of their minds hearts and pocket books….they(allopaths)are the destroyers of modern peoples health…deciet is their tool…they are evil….so,our money AND health are manipulated by central command and control hegemonistic organizations who put profits over people…the older i get the more my heart breaks….all have great new year…i learn much here,much…it is now one of my new simple pleasures….

  52. davy December 30, 2006 11:29 am

    I would remind #28 that is in the Fed’s Charter to buy the assets of any government, or corporation, etc., in order to maintain economic stability. Fannie Mae is the Chernobyl of financial institutions, we have decided to pour cement over the top of it, and try to ignore the problem. Unfortunately in this case the financial wizards are trying to live off the electricity.

  53. khill December 30, 2006 12:24 pm

    Debt based economic growth will not work now as there are no more viable bubbles to inflate.Housing was the last bubble available that could be used to avoid the pain cycle.The FED can push the peddle to the metal but the engine won’t respond.The horse will not drink the water.War spending looks like it too has reached it’s peak.The sheep have had enough war.Now the sheep will seek political blood.They will turn against their leaders.China has probably already created manufacturing over capacity.The age of cheap energy has passed.The only “cheap resource” left is human labor.Wages in the U.S. can not go up in real terms.There will be deflation as prices of U.S. stocks bonds and houses go down.An addict can never be trusted,they will be inclined to lie,steal and even kill.The U.S. is a most dangerous addict as it has two major addictions,debt and cheap energy.How this mess unravels we do not know.Got gold?

  54. davetrane11 December 30, 2006 7:50 pm

    I have greatly enjoyed the article and I have reviewed every post herein. To which, I must say that I am surprised that there is not one mention of the current inversion of U.S. Treasury interest rates. The last real inversion of interest rates was in Q3-2000 and we know what happened shortly thereafter. The current inversion has been ongoing for close to 6 months now and I believe 2007 is going to prove that yield-curve inversions are not to be taken lightly.

    I am fascinated by the common perception that the Federal Reserve is a proven non-stop inflation machine. Inherently, the Federal Reserve uses inflation and deflation to whipsaw the average bystander out of their savings. I don’t see how one economic machination is more favored over the other when the goal is to ensure that the publics savings ends up in the accounts of the shareholders of the Federal Reserve system. In addition, if inflation is the MO of the Federal Reserve system, then why did 2000-02′ and other deflationary declines throughout the last 100 years take place. It is clear that inflations and deflations are used to displace the public of their savings. The Federal Reserve is a conduit to ensure that they will foster one environment and then another until every last ounce of savings disappears into the bank vault of their owners. The public will always be left guessing what is next and that is exactly the way the Fed’s owners want it to be.


  55. ESPMan December 30, 2006 8:52 pm

    #54 There was no real deflation in 2000-2002, There was a bubble burst from the dot com irrational exuberance, there was 9-11 which shook the confidence of the nation, these two things had the power to bring about the real deflation in broad terms but the greenspan fed was more powerful.

    At that time, the already underway housing boom was catapulted into hyperspace by greenspan’s virtual elimination of the fed rate. The rates went so low that the place we are at now, 5.25, leaves no room for upside rate manipulation without bringing about an actual depression. The greenspan over - reaction by lowering the rate to 1 percent has brought about the space in time when the only thing left is inflate or die, as Puplava says.

    The political machine won’t let the fed totally kill the economy, therefore all the fed has left in its bag is to hype the deflation argument in the media and then begin inflating. There will be no deflation, there will be even more credit injected into the world, the dollar will fall but it is probably at least five years away from death. They will never, I repeat, never allow deflation to hit the U.S. economy in a broad sense. They will inflate the dollar into oblivion, kill it and then start the cycle over with a new currency. The new currency will be touted to be backed by metals, however, that will soon giveway to the fiat regime.

    The interest of the central banks is not to kill their golden goose, why should they when all they must do is recycle it? Prices in various sectors, including housing will adjust. just as the equity markets adjust, everything adjusts but to equate this with deflation is a huge mistake. No deflation. Housing will be declared mostly recovered in late 2007 as the fed cuts rates by fifty basis points in 2007 and confidence in credit rises once again, buoyed by the American buyer. The democrats will try to rescind the bankruptcy law passed by the republicans, there will be a deal made and they will get their way. America is a credit machine, that is all we have, they will not let is slip away until the dollar has fallen by another fifty percent and the time is ripe for the new currency move. Also, inflation is needed to finance wars. We will be fighting wars for the next fifty years, minimum until we have a break in the action.

  56. PB45 December 30, 2006 9:21 pm

    Hello posters,

    The points that are made here are the same over and over. The variations are a matter of degree only. My approach to understanding investing and politics has always to concentrate on what is not meant for public consumption. The reason why we seem to always have the reasons, yet we have no solutions, is simply we do not know the extent and the depth of the problems. We only estimate them in an unprofessional manner using fallacious premises to reach a conclusion.
    For example ask yourself why did Bush, Bearnake & Paulson go to Beijing recently? We have 5 reasons that are all speculative in nature when the obvious is ignored. They are showboating and stalling for time an old Fed and govt tried true approach. But why are they stalling? For what reason? Maybe a dollar collapse or derivative implosion that jibes with their own agenda.

    We have a massive armada of naval ships occupying Middle East and some Asian waters, Why? We cannot know but it is meant to send a message of fear! To whom? Russia, Iran or China or just showboating again. Frankly their weapons far exceed the capabilities of our Navy today.

    Why does our newly elected Democratic majority NOT impeach Bush for his treasonous acts or even reverse his destruction of our Bill of Rights’ guarantees? Again stalling and why you say? The conclusion again is obvious. They are deliberately selling out the American citizenry, the very same way they encouraged the exporting of so many more jobs than were actually necessary to benefit America. So many jobs could have been saved with some small domestic adjustments. Is price the only factor in service jobs, technical jobs or IT jobs? Think about it!-was it Really necessary? No not at all, but there is a grand scheme just as the North American Treaty agreement is a forgone conclusion without any public or Congressional input.

    Large destructive acts are meant always to camouflage and obfuscate the real motive. Just see You tube footage on WTC 9/11’s controlled implosions.

    That is why as individuals we must be content with in hand precious metal acquisition, but do you really think a divise govt such as this one will not confiscate, nationalize (miners) or windfall tax them into oblivion and take them over? You think GLD and other ETFs bullion hoards are immune from it’s military or strategic mineral status they will insist exists?

    Study US history and see the U.S. has been replete with industry wise localized confiscations with a special variety of tactics that deprive the citizens of REAL wealth and safety.They earned it through hard work, military or domestic service (cops, firemen).

    I read with interest even on this board many posters are saying why doesn’t the govt. bailout housing, Fannie Fae or even the banks. The reason again is obvious they do not care one iota about the individual just about their votes. Now they are ready to renege and/or allow all promises: health, social security, pensions and on your very money. They have robbed SSS pensioners for 15 yrs thru 1.3% increase in face of 5-10% inflation (and they are the old and disabled), so why would they care about 20-50 yr. olds? They do not care at all.

    We know and perceive only a small part of the puzzle or their plans, but we DO KNOW it is as evil and inhuman as possible.

    The bottom line is we are left to fend for ourselves as a society and as individual families. Make as many plans for your survival requiring food, water, shelter, health and barter connection sites. Weapons are of no use at all as you will be a grain of sand on the beach.Weapons and ammo have economic value as many would rather “Live free or Die”. If you have nukes then that requires special thought, LOL.

    Why was President Kennedy the only president that wanted to disband the Fed. shot and killed with his brother the Att.General? Why was the proof sequestered and hidden for 40 years? Why was Ronald Reagan shot shortly after establishing a privatized AmeriTrust for the salvation of Medicare & SSS and entrusted it to the persecuted Ambassador Leo Wanta? The govt spin has reduced Leo Wanta to a joke or scam, but I assure he is not. There are many documents with his signature for millions and even billions of USD$

    The govt had already built detention centers a myriad of new crowd control weapons. Why for what? Are we to be surprised by a military or private takeover leading to marshal control? You know it already. The US incarcerates 1 in 363 citizen in jail and then only repealed Habeas Corpus and the Commission Comitatus that disallowed military use domestically. We jail more people than every other country including Russia (figures for China are unavailable). YOU MEAN WANTS COMING DOWN THE PIKE EVERYONE DOES NOT SUSPECT ALREADY?

    I have dozens more questions, but you get the point by now. I would love to be refuted by facts not the standard name-callings./Peter

  57. davetrane11 December 30, 2006 9:28 pm

    Sounds like a nice rosy picture wrapped-up in a bow. As I said prior, the public is sold on the idea that the Federal Reserve is a non-stop inflation machine. The Fed has the majority of investorspeculators right where they want them. From one financial machination to another, from inflation to deflation to inflation to deflation.

    And yes, the 2000-2002 decline was deflation of prior credit excess abuse. Arguing that the burst of artificially-credit induced financial bubbles is not deflationary, but simply irrational exuberance is absolutely ridiculous. That means that the burst of the housing bubble or the commodity bubble or the stock bubble or the credit bubble that is driving this madness is only irrational exuberance, but never-never-never ever deflation.

    The majority out there is thinking this charade of pseudo-inflation will go on forever..

    Real rates are as high as they were in 1998 right now as I am typing this message. The Federal Reserve is already contracting economic activity at only 5.25%. Why?…Because the levels of debt are exponentially higher than even some 5 years ago. Every incremental increase in interest rates is tightening the noose around investor/speculators necks.

    I say the Federal Reserve is about to serve ‘Duck Dinner’…


  58. johnisjohn December 30, 2006 9:43 pm

    “Every incremental increase in interest rates is tightening the noose around investorspeculators necks.”

    Baloney. Real interest rates are still negative because inflation is actually running at 2X-3X the rates officially recognized and reported. The Fed talks tough about inflation, but until they jack rates to 10%, they are just talking smack.

  59. davetrane11 December 30, 2006 10:00 pm

    Real interest rates are nowhere near being negative right now when the PPI is in a dramatic decline on a year-over-year basis. Other times when this happened was in the early 1980’s, 1987, 1998 and 2000-02′. The Fed Funds Rate is significantly higher than the Y-O-Y CPI/PPI inflation. This is very significant because aggregate demand is declining and a burgeoning economic debt contraction is finally coming to fruition.

    No wonder this maniacal debt bubble continues to survive (for now) when investorspeculators have been worked-up into a frenzy in the belief that the Federal Reserve or U.S. Treasury or Caribbean Hedge Funds or the International Bank of Settlements in Basel, Switzerland are secretly inflating, inflating, inflating…


  60. Simon December 30, 2006 10:01 pm

    The Fed says a lot of things. Most importantly, it says that its mission is to support price stability.

    It has done a terrible job of this, as the dollar has lost about 99% of its value since 1913. Is this due to 1) incompetence, or was it 2) willful deceit?

    Neither answer is very appealing. If it is #1, incompetence, then why should we expect that they are able to do anything right?

    If it is #2, then why should we believe anything they say? If they say they want to avoid deflation, shouldn’t we believe the exact opposite of what they say?

    Fool me once, shame on you…

    Is there a third option that I missed?

    - Simon

    p.s. - there have been some excellent posts here. There are obviously very intelligent people reading this site.

  61. Rich December 30, 2006 10:47 pm

    Incompetence didn’t allow the creation of the derivative mountain we all sleep under. Exotic financial instruments take a certain amount of evil-genius to contrive, that ain’t no accident!

    When you add in the fact that they are unregulated, but traded by banks that are backed by the FDIC, you get a really yummy toxic soup of deceit.

    The sheeple are to be fleeced, all we do on this site is squabble over “when” and sometimes “how.”

    Cheers Rich

  62. ESPMan December 30, 2006 10:55 pm

    #57 Price or value deflation in one sector of the economy is an adjustment. When we speak of deflation we are speaking of it in the broader sense of the entire economy deflating. A deflationary recession or depression would result. There is stagflation at present though statistics show inflation is beginning to reach various wage sectors. The housing sector today is able to withstand high inventory levels easier than it could in previous housing sector contractions. The current deflation in many areas of the housing economy is said by many to be a drag on the whole economy and will be responsible for total economic deflation. The fed will not let this happen. They will drop rates to zero overnight before they let the housing deflation spill over into everything. There will be no total economic deflation in this country as long as the fed can inflate, period, end of story. House values and other areas were inflating during the 2000-2002 period. There was no deflation. There was a lot of buzz about deflation just as there is now, and what happened? Greenspan inflated. That is exactly what we are going through now only in a much more debt laden country. The buzz about a total economic deflation is just that,…buzz.

  63. davetrane11 December 30, 2006 11:53 pm

    A. The housing sector today is able to withstand high inventory levels easier than it could in previous housing sector contractions.

    —Well you can discount the price as much as you want, but eventually the chickens come home to roost.

    B. The current deflation in many areas of the housing economy is said by many to be a drag on the whole economy and will be responsible for total economic deflation.

    —The fact is that the real estate bubble was intended to keep the 70% consumption-driven U.S. economy alive and well. The real estate bubble was intended to offset the slowdown in the U.S. stock market and corporate spending from 2000.

    C.. There will be no total economic deflation in this country as long as the fed can inflate, period, end of story. House values and other areas were inflating during the 2000-2002 period. There was no deflation. There was a lot of buzz about deflation just as there is now, and what happened?

    —So according to your logic, $8 trillion in stock market wealth never disappeared from 2000-02′. The only reason your argument might appear to be valid is because the Federal Reserve lowered interest rates to record lows from 2001-03′. In addition, a 70% consumption driven U.S. economy based on an outrageous real estate bubble temporarily masked the underlying debt fiasco that was heading toward a necessary reconciliation.


  64. PB45 December 31, 2006 3:56 am

    Hello posters,
    Does anyone wonder why we the US citizens are totally lied to concerning every issue not just economic? or why our elected officials spend recklessly with regard for our futures or the futures of our children?
    Why has the govt developed five new crowd control (read disabling)weapons for use in the US. BTW, many unknown or unaccounted severe injuries were discovered in the attacks on Lebanon.
    Instead of dialoguing about a 1% interest rate move up or down why has the public in general been dumbed down to believe all the spin. Today people can no longer see the forrest as the Fed et al. have shifted focus to the trees.
    Ask yourselves why all the subtrifuge, the need for internationally trackable National ID Cards( with all your personal data: health, tax, income, religion, ethnicity, voting, SSS info, credit debt and political leanings)? the new RIFDS tag locators on all items you wear , buy and operate. Cell phones and computers which spy on owners and report back your wearabouts and conversations. The US govt is more suspicious than a jeaulous lover for sure. All perfect for profiling undesirables, terrorists or troublemakers. Who says who is who?
    One would wonder if they want to know if you Summer ski in Davos, Switzerland or swim in the warm Winter waters in the Cayman Islands. Maybe even suspecting some clandestine banking when in fact you do ski, swim and gamble in those places. get a lawyer and fight them while in detention ala Guantanamo(no rights US capitol).
    Why does the govt in collusion with the Fed/banks ascribe to 120% ARMs and thus insuring poor ethnic minorities and plain poor folk to go broke within the next 2 years.
    Why does the govt ignore the underfunded pensions funds we all rely on to go underfunded? Or raid our SSS TRUST funds (sort of an oxymoron wouldnt you agree).
    Why are all the corporate options exercisers backdating and fleecing the investor allowed to go free and unmolested?
    Why are the vast large caps being sold by corporate insiders ie Microsoft, et al.?
    Why are stocks systematically pumped up with Fed assistance and then deflated like the Hindenberg over and over? In effect our 401Ks are 201Ks since the USD$ depreciates and only rising in nominal terms not real terms.
    No posters here complain or even question the system in place. Instead we debate inflationary, deflationary, stagflationary, ad nauseum. You posters are the bright ones, the “out of the box thinkers and contrarians” and you debate with with absolute assuredness with people you dont know from Adam. Never considering a govt that ignores you, your country and your environment. they gave you the circuses and you love them!
    The die is cast fellow posters, the decisions are already made. Fiat destruction is assured, war is/will be the absolute that brings us together as always (as it did back to the Civil War on up).
    Our freedoms are now de-legalized and the detention centers a fact, NorthCOM a fact and massive crowd control weapons devised and in place. Not cameras totally yet as in England, but real soon fellow posters(we are geographically larger that is why).
    In all of history there are loosers and survivers. When the animals start running south do you go south?, but when the sheeple run for the exits be sure they are bared already.
    Do we need an engraved invitation to watch the a massive naval armada in the Mid East let loose it’s carnage before & pulverize humans before you understand the truths of evil and malice?
    Do you sense a general unhappiness in Americans that heretofore was absent? Yes of course, they are angry they will lose their toys but not their Constitutional Rights.
    Any of the above indictments of the US govt will gladly be supplied by me with multiple websites, writers and witnesses outlining everything mentioned here & post #56 can and will be furnished.
    First we must know the enemy for what he is to understand his weaknesses./P

  65. the stranger December 31, 2006 10:09 am

    Excellent as usual B45 - except for the presumption that the readership or contributor doesn’t generally agree.

  66. zephyr December 31, 2006 10:09 am

    PB45, now here’s what I’ve been talking about. Big thumbs up!! Are we just to sit and watch while the govt ties us up and breaks out the anal lube! Yeah, Democrats were voted in in a landslide. Yet, no real talk of change. Because they don’t really answer to us, if they ever did. Read the street signs people. That police state is just around the corner. Easier to fight before your hands are tied.

  67. skeptical December 31, 2006 10:10 am

    Simon Says:

    If it is #2, then why should we believe anything they say? If they say they want to avoid deflation, shouldn’t we believe the exact opposite of what they say?”

    Simon, I beleive you hit the nail on the head. This I beleive is why benny was put in as fed head. Who would think he would ALLOW a deflation - no one (well only a couple). Therefore, everyone who beleives he will not allow a deflation will be wrong as the “everyones” are ALWAYS wrong.

    And #64 PB45, I think most (or many) here alread know what you speak of. Anyone who has spent any time on the internet knows this stuff (dont they??). Nonetheless life must go on, or should we give up and leave for Costa Rica? I dont know what the answer is to all your MOST VALID points (and I could expand your list for 1000 pages of evidence of the intentional evil). The intentional evil propogated by the PTB is the reason that I beleive inflation must end so as to hurt the most people (debtors) and take the most wealth.

  68. Kia December 31, 2006 10:56 am


    Don’t think that you are alone.

    We have reached at point in human history where the world’s financiers, who make politicians look like lil’ Orphan Annie are all united against the world’s populace.

    The question remains for all of us is what are we going to do? Ending Fiat currencies would be a fine start.

    2007 is our opportunity.


  69. davetrane11 December 31, 2006 11:02 am

    PB45, Skeptical et al…..

    I do think Ben Bernanke is the perfect deception by the owners of the Federal Reserve. The speech in 2003 by Benny was an absolutely brilliant example of setting the palate. Who would question now that Benny and the Fed will fight deflation? Brilliant.

    I see the Federal Reserve as a conduit to swing back and forth between inflation and deflation. No single environment is preferred over the other because the entity of the Federal Reserve is intended to relocate the savings of the average bystander into the accounts of the Federal Reserve’s shareholders.


  70. Kia December 31, 2006 11:22 am

    This is lifted from Tom Carter at:


    My New Years Resolution

    It has always been my habit to ignore traditions such as New Years resolutions due to the intrinsic value of drunken promises.

    This year I have decided to compose a set of fifteen resolutions prior to beginning my yearly ritualistic alcohol fest. They go like this:

    I resolve to remember:

    1. In America: We elect Representatives not leaders or kings

    2. Corporations are not living breathing natural persons and thus should never enjoy Constitutional rights as persons.

    3. The first ten amendments of the Constitution of the United States (also known as the Bill rights) are not amendable.

    4. Taxes collected and then spent against the will of the people constitutes taxation without representation.

    5. The Constitution of the United States of America contains no language declaring America “Policeman to the world”.

    6. True American Patriots support and defend the United States Constitution NOT a political party or even FOX news.

    7. Defending the United States Constitution is not a criminal terrorist act regardless
    of any legalese contained in the Patriot Act.

    8. A fascist government by definition; cannot enact the will of the people.

    9. If George Bush could become President ANYONE of us could also be President.

    10. Electing lawyers to serve in congress is akin to appointing Mark Foley Boy Scout Troop leader.

    11. The original intent of the FCC was to prevent monopolization of the air waves, not to squelch free speech or hide Janet Jackson’s nipples.

    12. Jesus is not a republican

    13. Jesus is GW Bush’s favorite philosopher not his God.

    14. Statutory law often runs ruff-shod over the United States Constitution.

    15. There is no measurable difference between Republicans and Democrats

    Happy New year.

    Keep the faith

  71. larry December 31, 2006 2:28 pm

    wow…intense posts!….wow

  72. James December 31, 2006 4:49 pm

    Still no answer to number two. when is it going to happen and how do we time our protection.

  73. PB45 December 31, 2006 5:15 pm

    Hello posters,
    I will say one thing about economics that has,IMO, been skirted. Inflation is a planned raid by govt on the citizens wealth thru money expansion by several modes.
    Deflation is an un planned uncontrollable event (ala Japan). A country such as the US is a country with infinite debt and no savings and no large production capacity( excepting weapony) we are in worse shape to handle a deflationary collapse. The Fed knows it. the Fed see the housing debt spiral and/or derivative implosion
    and are manically reliquidifying. If the nation rebukes the cheap and huge credit they are done for.
    Why of that is simple. The Fed has used the US investor and his consummer capacity, the Fed has used the Hedge funds ala the Amarath LPG forced liquidation, and the Fed/ via the Goldman’s have foisted on the debt for credit swaps, bogus Fannie Mae & F. Mac mortgage bonds on the Mutual and Pension Funds. So what suckers are left? All factions all hate the insidious Fed. Even the Chinese uncharacteristically & vehemently rebuked the recent US Bush-Bernake-Paulson bully boys. Russia has basically dumped on the West(Europe & US/Canada) and created LNG shortages, price rises and cohersed many US allies. Big oil has had to ante up or get fined out of Sakelin Islands. No we are not alone in our dismay and disgust with our New World to be govt.
    It is good that the discussion seems to have evolved a notch higher.
    Yes, life does go on Skeptical. I am not a believer in santuaries especially Costa Rica (many reasons I personally know of). Hopefully you are correct about what I stated is common knowledge on the internet. If it is not I fear the US citizen will be blindsided and corraled.
    No what I am suggesting is that posters openly discuss the acts and events leading to govt’s intended control.
    Set a network of advice on subjects that most would not consider. We know from economics that good money drives out bad money, but what good is a public with kilo bars or even 1 oz Krugerrands that cannot be divided. A market must arise on the internet;however, the internet is obviousl becomes their next target.
    The need for unity on some level is a must and continued infomation dispersal should be our goal. It is mine.
    I was a willing particpant in Nam. I enlisted and did my patriotic schtick in defending our conuntry from a bunch of underarmed, undernourished, yet an indefagitable foe with a fighting spirit to protect their homeland. We slept at night under our ponchos and huts in the lush jungle to awaken to a denuded area of stick trees. As a result, I am sure, I developed later in 1983 MS as a result of this nerve agent. I am NO martyr or hero, as a matter of fact I am ashamed of the pain and destruction I caused. The US uses 18y-20yr mindless unthinking humans for their ends. It is obvious that a healthy 30yr with life experience could easily mop the floor with these kids, but they know too much alread so are excluded as being dangerous to govt.The 30 yr old is amore dangerous soldier so wh not use him?
    Try not to misconstue what I have been saying here. The best way for us now is to prepare ourselves physically and mentally for what is at hand.
    One poster back up the thread was quite correct with his equation: Inflation leads to Deflation which leads to countermeasure Hyperinflation and ultimately Martial Law.
    The worrying thing is in NorthCom the North American Treaty Alliance Army will hire Mexican and S. American poor to be involved as an mercenary army. TPTBe realize US military are unlikely to kill, control or incarcerate their US brothers for very long. The rub is poor Mexican mercenaries will pull the trigger to earn for their starving families.
    Civil Disobedience has long been a strategy that has worked. Ghandi showed the British Empire it’s merits.Many smaller countries with dictatorships have stood up in unison to thwart control. Philippines/Marcos comes to mind. The govt must adapt or come to a standstill. This strategy requires bravery, bravado and a willingness for sacrifice. Frankly this not as difficult as it seems, being divided and hauled away is much harder & final.
    Exchange thoughts for survival preparation ie: water, food, shelter provisions and most importantly communications in shortwave radios, shorter range walkie talkies. Guns are not the answer as the USSR found out. Network with neighbors casually at first, educate, illuminate and distract them from their SUVs, 54 inch TVs and govt inspired circus events (organized violence eg. Football, Rubgby, Hockey and notice most are Western in nature as the world chooses Soccer which is not as physically violent, biking and running).Point out govt discrepancies in inflated money, govt lies and 9/11.
    We the US civilians have been the unknowing & willing tool for military dominance. This is ending. Victor Corpus an Asian general has step by step shown how all our sophisticated weapons have been inexpensively countered by Russian, Chinese and Middle Eastern out of economic necessity.
    If a majority knows what is to occur a great hue & cry can stifle many of their moves. They are cowards as all bullies are. They are old and rich and have more to lose than men defending their families.
    I have not picked up my hand against my fellow man since the 1960’s, but as crippled as I am now-I would as I think most would for their families. Civil Disobedience can and will work if one is prepared ahead of time and it requires no more bravery than our boys in Iraq are doing currently against faceless, nameless enemies.
    A rebellious unwilling army may be the start of Civil Disobedience. But going to your personal bunkers insures a Waco type response and outcome.Avoid a macho last stand approach, the army is trained to neutral such responses.
    Civil disobedience can be many things. A boycott of public consuming, or tax nonpayments or active road clogging. The Civil Service is a key here as 1 out 3 American are govt employees. The New Order will not require even 1% of these employees and when they find their pensions are bogus they will be really pissed and feisty-you watch!
    I believe even the minmally educated know what’s coming inmany ways and would gladly particpate in protecting the original intentions of our founders of our Constitution.
    Why, because they have benefitted more than any other poor group in any other country-It is worth fighting for in a reasoned manner not in a vilolent rioting spree. That would only give an excuse to TPTBe./Peter
    Read our Constitution!! NOW Understand what has been taken from us and spread the word NOW(2007)

  74. PB45 December 31, 2006 5:37 pm

    I want to add a refrain. I love America, I love Americans (all races, colors and religions), but abhor what the govt. has forced the latest generation to become thru phony erroneous education, upside-down policies, voodoo economics and destruction of religion in American. Most of all they bribed the current parents of this current generation with perks galore while actually abondoning them in their time of greatest need during the ravages of Katrina and the multiple pleas to all levels of govt.
    Long live our Constitution!/Peter It is easy to critize and everyone always has an opinion, but I urge you to focus on current developments as they occur. Write your Representatives. Tell them their personal records will be published on display at the internet. Expose the willing collaborators-dont let them sleep. A massive campagn that numerous organizations such a Mr. Gnazzo, Hon. Ron Paul and the “Freedom to Tyranny” producer has started.
    If you don’t “because they only come for those patriots only” who will protect your family when they come for you??? The only thing that can defeat Americans are their own INACTION!/P

  75. the stranger December 31, 2006 6:20 pm

    As I’m all ready to head out tonight, I open a St. Pauli Girl and turn on the lap top. Still an hour away, so a little catch-up on Sinclair’s site then check in Bull, not bull. I didn’t think I’d be posting now, but damn Peter, you’re on a roll. And it reminds me…

    One thing I am guilty of on this site is; I don’t comment enough “other’s” posts, and I’ve taken a lot from them. There is a unique conversation that allows other to build or maintain confidence, for sane, accurate, and necessary but less than mainstream perspectives. Can’t remember commenting on Larry’s posts, for example; I look forward to them. Never commented on Breck either; he can fuckin’ put it down (as another example, can’t think of everyone).

    So Christ Peter, I appreciate you’re layin’ it down tonight. You’ve said nothing un-American. It is a privilege to have the caliber of conversation we here. My brother was in Nam (dead now); I missed it as it ended when I graduated high school. The more you write, the more I find to agree with. Just wanted to thank you for bothering to write it, I guess.

  76. Marc Authier December 31, 2006 6:45 pm

    Well George W. said in private that the Constitution is just a piece of paper. A piece of paper won’t protect a nation from anything. Prudent inaction is better than acting without thinking like a stupid vengefull moron. Yes I am thinking about the Bush’s Irak fiasco and the next round Iran. By the way money is just a piece of paper and you can count on the FED and all the other crooks in central banking do use the infinite power of printing. They share the same attitude towards pieces of paper as Dubya. I don’t believe in paper may it be the Constitution or the Dollar. Paper is just what it is paper. Paper has no value if the people behind it are crooks or bandits or incompetents.

  77. Rabach December 31, 2006 7:42 pm

    Deflation? Inflation? How about both!

    Someone who posted in the last open discussion said something on the order of…what you need will double in price, what you don’t need will halve in price…

    I don’t know if things will necessarily be that extreme BUT with the economy on crutches now people certainly won’t buy as many things as they don’t need. With sales dropping on things such as a new barbecue grill I could see prices going a lot lower on that type of stuff. On the other hand food in my area has been on a rise in price for quite some time.

    In fact the price of food is really getting out of hand. I live in northern Michigan and my family of 2 are spending 800-900 per month minimal to feed ourselves. We do shop mostly organic but the prices at the regular grocery store keep going up substantly also. I would truly only save a few hundred by eating non-organic.

    I am sure gas will go up again next year. Who knows? Maybe we can all pay $4 a gallon. Just remember these couple of words ‘product obsolence’. That price on the new barbecue grill may go down but it is probably being made a lot cheaper. Thanks crapmart!!!

    I have noticed over the years this HIDDEN INFLATION that NOONE SEEMS TO BE TALKING ABOUT. I will give one example using vacuum cleaners as I own a janitor service.

    In 1998 I bought a Hoover vacuum cleaner at Walmart for $114. This was not the top model (for those who are younger YES vacuum cleaners used to cost a lot more.) This vacuum was put into use in the business. Well 1999 I had need to have 2 vacuum cleaners so I went back to Walmart to purchase a second. They still had the ’same’ vacuum cleaner there but it was only $89. I had to keep an eye at the ceiling to make sure a price didn’t hit me in the head.

    1999 was a busy year and I did a lot of vacuuming. That newer vacuum came with a much shorter cord (13ft instead of 25ft) so I had to purchase a $10 extension cord. The hose was a different color though it never seemed to make a difference. Well the newer vacuum broke down on me first and started working like crap. The older vacuum continued on its merry way. Did I really save money?

    I finally quit the business in ‘99 and in ‘04 I had restarted one. Off to find a vacuum. I went back to Walmart to purchase another Hoover only to find the most expensive model, which I purchased, was $56. I had used that vacuum less than 2 weeks and 14 hours when it started smoking and nearly caught on fire. Wow! My insurance company would have loved me if I burnt down one of my accounts!!! I took the piece of crap back to crapmart and got a refund.

    I went up to Sears and found a decent vacuum for $139 in spring of’05 quickly after I returned the other one. This vacuum still works in ‘06 and has been used hundreds of hours. It is about ready to break, though I believe I got my money out of it. In ‘06 I went back up to Sears and purchased another vacuum. They did not have that same vacuum (Yet another point they are CONSTANTLY changing things on their shelves, literally every month!) but I found a comparable one for $149.

    A month later I had gotten another couple of accounts and went back to Sears to purchase more of those vacuums. I needed 2 more. They only had one of those old ones and a new ‘identical’ one. This identical one for the same price had a 3′ shorter cord. They had lowered the quality of that vacuum in ONE MONTH. As of now all of those vacuums I purchased from Sears are still in comission.

    I have seen the quality decrease in stuff such as phones, paper cutters and other items to the point where I can NOT find a good quality item no matter how much I pay. I could go on and on about this problem. This is HIDDEN INFLATION. You are NOT buying the same product that you did years ago.

    1.) The product and/or the majority of the parts are now made in a foreign country for pennies on the dollar that it used to be made for.

    2.) Technology has allowed new materials that can make products cheaper as well as provided cheaper means of manufacturing.

    3.) Most products are built with inferior quality. Those forces those who are quality conscious to spend a BUNDLE more $ to get the quality and longevity they expect out of the product. (Just try finding good quality furniture!)

    This is hidden inflation and while I am on the subject of PRICE INCREASES let me give you a story about my father.

    In 1942 my father purchased 39 acres with an unfinished house for $1,500. A lot of money back in those days right? Wrong!!! He did have to take out a loan but he earned $2 an hour as an auto mechanic back then. He also picked up odd and end jobs doing construction work. The house was paid off in 3 years.

    When my father finished the house he did not have to pay for inspections. THERE WHERE NONE. Someone taught him how to hook up the electrical and he did it. All he had to do then was have the electric company come and actually hook the house up. The same was true with the plumbing and septic.

    In the same time my father, an auto mechanic with a stay at home wife raising kids, bought 2 trailers and another house on property as rentals. He paid off the 2 trailers and the land but sold the house before paying it off.

    My dad always had money in his wallet. He bought cars with cash. In 1935 at the age of 15 he bought a used Model T for $15 dollars. The car lasted him problem free for a couple of years!!! Even then as a farm boy he could earn a dollar a day. Imagine buying a dependable used car nowadays for 15 days of work. Even better imagine not having to pay auto insurance and tax on your fuel. You could even use kerosene to run your vechile.

    Things have changed a lot. People now owe on their house for 30 or even 40 years. A lot of retires still owe on their house and/or have a lot of other debt. The drastic differences between yesterday and today are like black and white. Without TRUE history we can never realize what we lost.

    I am not sure how things were for everyone during the Great Depression but I can tell you one thing. If we have another depression it will be real bad. When my dad was young and went through the great depression as poor farmers their life changed little. The money they had in the bank was locked up for a year. When the back finally gave back money they only gave then 50 cents on the dollar. The only major difference is they didn’t have any gifts given to each other during the year. My grandmother still made them clothes and purchased sugar, flour, etc…at the end of each summer. They still listenend to the radio with a wind generated battery charger each night there was something on. They were happy people though.

    No electricity, a hand pump well, homemade clothes, a small school house, a sleigh for winter travel, farming and in spite of this happiness. They were a family even though my father’s father (or my grandfather) died while my dad was only 2. Nowadays if one lived like that and had children the Child Protection Services social worker would sweep their kids away from them because of the extreme child abuse. Ridiculous!!!

    Look how far we have come…think how much worse it will get!


    Have a Happy New Year!

  78. Rabach December 31, 2006 7:47 pm


    Very well said.

    For those who are interested in the truth educate yourselves and others by watching these video on google…

    Terrorstorm (Alex Jones)

    Freedom to Fascism (Aaron Russo)



  79. Libby December 31, 2006 8:30 pm

    Senator Reid just went to Ecuador with five demoncrats. What were they doing?
    Making a deal with the devil. He even told the new Ecaudor Prez (a closet communist) it was okey dokey to remove our troops from our anti-drug base down there! With the Republicrats going to China on their knees begging them to keep buying our treasury debt, and the Demoblicans making deals with our enemies, well, I is a gonna git my gun!

  80. NIsh December 31, 2006 9:10 pm


    Sorry for the early response with the email. I understand your reasoning in this article but I believe you are missing a few points. Government has become a bigger and bigger share of the economy, probably close to 40 to 50% or more of the spending power of the economy. It is delebrite ofcourse with homeland security, the war, becoming the big brother of retirees, etc. Thus government can expand the curreny / loans by borrowing from the FED to run these programs, thus inflation can continue. In addition, the purpose of money, paper or gold, is to consume goods. Therefore either way the bank wins, the bank now has homes of the common folks who foreclosed for free, remember the bank only put up 10% or so as “actual” loan, the rest was created loan. So the bank gained property for 10% of the value of the house. In addition, if inflation continues, the banks rate of return is over 60% , not sure if the math is right, but 6% on 100,000 loan, but 90,000 is created, so 6000 per year on a 10,000 actual investment. Either way inflation or deflation, the owners of the bank and the FED gain access to more and more consumption and ownership using this game they created.


  81. davetrane11 January 1, 2007 3:31 am

    “Either way inflation or deflation, the owners of the bank and the FED gain access to more and more consumption and ownership using this game they created.”


    This is exactly what I have been saying in every one of my posts on this board. The Federal Reserve is an entity that is used to whipsaw between inflation and deflation to literally steal the savings of the average bystander. Free market forces can whipsaw/steal from the average bystander? Yes, this may be true also. However, the current world financial system is not a free market, but a quasi-controlled system that is entirely contrived for the benefit of the shareholders of the Federal Reserve system itself.

    I refer you to Thomas Jefferson…How right he was proven to be….

    “If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks…will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered…. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs.”


  82. davetrane11 January 1, 2007 3:46 am

    “If Congress has the right to issue paper money it was given to them to be used by…and not to be delegated to individuals or corporations”

    – President Andrew Jackson, Vetoed Bank Bill of 1836

    “The bold effort by the present (central bank) had made to control the government…are but premonitions of the fate that await the American people should they be deluded into a perpetuation of this institution or the establishment of another like it.”

    “I am one of those that do not believe that a national debt is a national blessing, but rather a curse to a republic; inasmuch as it is calculated to raise around the administration a moneyed aristocracy dangerous to the liberties of the country.”

    –Andrew Jackson

  83. the stranger January 1, 2007 10:43 am

    I if psot anthying tdoay, plseae dno’t raed it…

  84. kia January 1, 2007 11:35 am

    PB45/Peter (#73,74,77) I posted the brief history of fiat currency:

    inflation->deflation-> hyperinflation->martial law.

    I came to age during the Vietnam War, Watergate, and the Energy Crisis. My draft number came up as we warmed up the helicopters to evacuate Saigon. So I missed the nightmare of what dioxin did to your nervous system. For what it worth, thank you for your service.

    Ford’s pardon of Nixon allowed nothing else ever to be investigated. If word got out about US misdeeds the standard procedure was point to the lowest soldier and prosecute him. Lt. Calley was guilty but the Brass above him were innocent. Lyndie England gets prosecuted but Rumsfeld will probably work for Halliburton.
    And then are the criminals Cheney/Bush/Blair who deserve to be tried ahead of all other candidates put together. Justice has nothing to do with the Legal system and Orwell was right:

    Ignorance is Strength
    War is Peace
    Freedom is Slavery

    My question for all posters is “What have the Americans learned in 30 years?” From where I sit it doesn’t matter whether Johnson, Moyers and McNamara were selling me on the War on Communism in S.E. Asia or Rumsfeld, Cheney/Bush, and Rice selling me on the War on Terrorism in the Middle East. The commonality is that Kellogg Brown and Root was/is ripping the taxpayer off for fuel prices. Thus the names change, but the nickels go into the same pockets.

    The US has invaded foreign countries 201 times since WWII with zero functioning democracies to show for it. If you stand back and look at it you see the hubris of our course. The UK was occupying Iraq in 1929 for the purpose of controlling the oil. Their occupation failed and crushed their currency. The US is replaying the same game 75 years later and it will have the same effect on the USD.

    Here’s a good year-end round-up of what the MSM didn’t tell you. Be sure to read #2 on Halliburton selling nuclear technology to Iran:

    Only when we see these events as patterns can we stop them. Otherwise plan for more false flag chaos. and Republicrat consitutional amendments against flag burning, gay marriage and impeaching war criminals.

    Peace Today, Tomorrow and Forever.

  85. PB45 January 1, 2007 4:51 pm

    Kia, Thanks for your thoughts.
    My concern now is the internet. Once gone all escape routes and opposition collapses. ALL participants will easily be located and neutralized under Bush Law (No Habeas Corpus) a la Guantanamo.
    The Amero will not solve the USD$’s problems.
    The remaining Americans will be pliable 1984 like lover’s of the state. Whether they will produce or sabotage is TPTBe’s inate problem.
    Consequences of a fear are far less than the fear itself. Learn, study, educate and enlighten while the chance remains.
    To the bold: leave now, anywhere. Rebuild a society destroyed by paper after the flood.
    Debt is the AntiGold,
    Debt is Slavery and
    Gold is the AntiUSD$ (all fiats).
    Civil Disobedience for you is all that remains. Renige on your all debt, renige on illegal tax obligations and form network groups.
    Obtain food, water, flashlights & batteries, candles & matches, blankets, medical supplies, maintain a safe house away from your acurrent abode, obtain short wave and walkies talkies for needed communication (not cell phones).
    I am not a survivalist!
    I am not a conspiracy theorist!
    I am old and crippled beyond help, but I can still supply the spirit and will to survive. Wisdom of the old can be a salvation.
    What I am is a survivor and a patriot despite the destruction of our Constitutional rights.
    I welcome contact with anyone with a serious concern, but eschew this debate on interest rates, the Fed and Infl/Deflation.
    Why? you may ask. Simply because all these events are forgone conclusions at this point and are only of interest to traders.
    Close the internet and see where will you trade? redeem your GLD bullion or blue chip miners and receive a wheel barrow FULL of FRN OR AMERO fiat.
    You act now and act decisively. You do not try convince people, you do not arm yourself and you prepare the necessities only!
    NOT weapons of reprisal or defense of property. The new they possess are weapons that are mind boggling in destruction accurancy and devastation.
    Webs will be supplied on request.
    2007 will be a test of survivorship. TPTBe forget onething. There are always bullies waiting for their chance, no group is immune as time will tell./Peter
    P.S. I pray for us all, I pray for peace and I pray for Liberty!

  86. tan January 1, 2007 6:13 pm

    This is incorrect: “[The Fed] MUST loan [money] into existence, but this REQUIRES willing borrowers.” (emphasis added)

    A very well written essay, but it is within the charter of the Fed to buy whatsoever they want with their newly printed dollars: stocks, bonds, houses, cars, toys. New money needn’t be borrowed into existence at all. That is the more P.C. method, of course, which is probably why you have assumed there is no alternative. In an emergency, direct monetization will immediately become a quite P.C. alternative.

    If your key premise is mistaken, as it is, your entire conclusion is untrustworthy. More correctly, we will have deflation if the Fed CHOSES to sit on its hands and accept catastrophic deflation (which will, incidently, nullify its political charter). Otherwise we will have something else. von Mises said that payback for credit bubbles cannot be escaped - I don’t believe he said there had to be “deflation”, which implies that the real purchasing power of the dollar goes up.

    Notably, the recent Argentinian depression was the end result of a credit bubble but it the depression was hardly “deflationary” for the Argentinian currency. Currency collapse is always an option, and generally the vastly better bet for fiat currencies debauched - as is our dollar.

    Thanks again for this and previous essays. In the future, I suggest you preface your deflationary beliefs AS beliefs and not as something inescapable. Even Prechter makes clear that the powers that be could chose a hyperinflation as end game. I expect they will, as a hyperinflation leaves the asset heavy with their assets, leaves more homeowners with their homes, probably leaves the Central Bankers with continued employment (see, once again, Argentina), and is more likely to leave the politicians with their power.

  87. davetrane11 January 1, 2007 9:36 pm

    Thanks again for this and previous essays. In the future, I suggest you preface your deflationary beliefs AS beliefs and not as something inescapable. Even Prechter makes clear that the powers that be could chose a hyperinflation as end game. I expect they will, as a hyperinflation leaves the asset heavy with their assets, leaves more homeowners with their homes, probably leaves the Central Bankers with continued employment (see, once again, Argentina), and is more likely to leave the politicians with their power.


    Sounds like that’s the goal here….But will it blow-up in their faces?….


  88. kia January 2, 2007 7:51 am


    I often wonder what would happen if EVERYONE refused to pay their credit card bills in 2007.

    They can’t lock us all up ;-)

  89. muleskinner January 2, 2007 8:04 am

    All of this inflation/deflation is insane.


    They’re Coming To Take Me Away
    Artist or band: Napoleon XIV
    Remember when you ran away
    And I got on my knees and begged you
    Not to go because I�d go beserk?

    You left me anyhow and
    Then the days got worse and worse
    And now you see I’ve gone completely
    out of my mind


    (chorus 1):
    They�re coming to take me away,
    Haha, they�re coming to take me away,
    Ho ho, hee hee, ha ha,
    To the funny farm
    Where life is beautiful all the time
    And I�ll be happy to see
    Those nice young men
    In their clean white coats
    And they�re coming to take me AWAY,

    You thought it was a joke,
    and so you LAUGHED, YOU LAUGHED!
    When I had said that losing you
    Would make me flip my lid,


    You know you laughed.
    I HEARD you laugh, you laughed
    And laughed and laughed
    And then you left,
    And now you see I�m utterly mad


    (chorus 2):
    They�re coming to take me away,
    Haha, they�re coming to take me away,
    Ho ho, hee hee, ha ha,
    To the happy home with trees and flowers
    And chirping birds and basket weavers
    Who sit and smile and
    Twiddle their thumbs and toes
    And they�re coming to take me away,

    I cooked your food,
    I cleaned your house,
    And this is how you pay me back
    For all my kind unselfish loving deeds


    Well, you just wait,
    They�ll get you yet,
    And when they do, they�ll put you in
    the ASPCA, you mangy MUTT,


    They�re coming to take me away,
    Haha, they�re coming to take me away,
    Ho ho, hee hee, ha ha,
    To the funny farm
    Where life is beautiful all the time
    And I�ll be happy to see
    Those nice young men
    In their clean white coats
    And they�re coming to take me AWAY,

    You thought it was a joke,
    and so you LAUGHED, YOU LAUGHED!
    When I had said that losing you
    Would make me flip my lid

  90. muleskinner January 2, 2007 8:24 am

    I know all about that quality of product business. My wife bought two famous brand mixers. The first one lasted about six years, after a fifty dollar repair, it was going again. Then it went on the fritz. She bought a new same famous brand name mixer. It lasted two years and now it is useless. It doesn’t work only after two years.

    What do you think should be done? Buy a new same famous brand mixer for a third time or buy an old American made mixer at a second hand store for ten dollars that will probably work for another ten years? New stuff isn’t worth buying at hundreds of dollars of cost and a product that doesn’t work. The next mixer is going to be an old American made mixer that will last. Enough of these new products that don’t work.

    If you don’t buy their useless stuff, the famous brand mixer company no longer has your business. Bad news for the famous brand mixer company. Their phone lines are busy night and day with other customers wanting a problem solved.

    It don’t look good for the famous name mixer company.

  91. mikeck44 January 2, 2007 9:18 am

    I always enjoy the comments here even if I have nothing to add. Today I’ll add something that those who are expecting deflation may want to take into consideration. M3 is back and is growing at about 11%. Increasing interest rates makes it look like the FED is in tight money mode, while M3b outs that lie.


  92. Roy Berger January 2, 2007 11:50 am

    Saturday 30 December 2006 20:05









    UPDATE NOTE, 1st January 2007: We have had a very large number of emails from the United States, mainly, and the question repeatedly asked is: WHY IS THE ‘MAINSTREAM MEDIA’ not covering this? DON’T ASK US: ASK THE ‘MAINSTREAM MEDIA’. We are not in a position to answer this question. The other question asked is: Can you verify this? Excuse us? How can any of this be published if it is not accurate at the time of posting? Do not confuse this site with your familiar run-of-the-mill US intelligence diversion and disinformation website. Instead of asking us such crude questions, may we suggest that people who, without a cause, suggest we are liars, are laying themselves open to risk, since such allegations can be addressed in the English Court, where the laws of libel are much more stringent than in the United States. Finally, ALL the relevant documents and back-up information are available in International Currency Review, Volume 31, Numbers 3 and 4 [December 2006], and also in International Currency Review, Volume 30, Numbers 2 and 3 [January 2005]. We are a UK commercial organisation and we will NOT provide free copies of these issues. We will accept and fulfil bona fide subscription/special issue orders. Criticism of what has been posted WITHOUT studying the FACTS published in International Currency Review is reckless and unwise. Neither is it to be recommended in this rapidly moving and unfolding crisis.

    By Christopher Story FRSA, Editor and Publisher, International Currency Review, World Reports Limited, London and New York: http://www.worldreports.org. Press CLICK HERE and the ARCHIVE Button on the http://www.worldreports.org Home Page for Wanta Crisis reports since April 2006. Note: Due to NSA/CIA et al interference, some US users may find they can access worldreports.org directly, without the http://www. Mostly, http://www.worldreports.org provides access to our website at once.

    US Treasury Secretary Paulson has been arrested by German authorities on a subpoena issued
    by the International Court of Justice, and brought before an ‘ad hoc’ Tribunal accused of money-laundering, misappropriation/diversion of colossal amounts of money, and non-payment/non-performance on the $4.5 trillion Wanta Plan Settlement.

    He has been sentenced to severe penalties [see below].

    Henry M. Paulson’s arrest by German authorities implementing the ‘World Court’ subpoena, took place on 23rd or 24th of December 2006.

    Although we have been ’sitting on’ this intelligence since the Christmas weekend, pending further information, we now have very high-level confirmations from both London and Washington, and a total of seven sources for this intelligence.

    The basic details are as follows:

    1. Records exist confirming that International Court of Justice subpoenas were issued against Henry M. Paulson, the U.S. Secretary of the Treasury, and Vice President Richard Cheney, citing inter alia money-laundering, misappropriation or diversion of colossal amounts of money, and non-performance on the Wanta Plan Settlement funds of $4.5 trillion, subject of http://www.worldreports.org postings since June 2006. This is an inevitable consequence of the corruption exposed on this website over the Wanta Settlement, for the past six months and more.

    2. A senior official within the US Treasury was placed under a gag order and was subpoenaed to travel to Germany to testify against Henry M. Paulson. The official has been in Germany for the past two weeks, testifying before US Consulate and Tribunal officials, and Germany’s Attorney General. The subject of his testimony has been the struggle that Ambassador Leo Wanta and his corporate Treasurer, Michael C. Cottrell, M.S., have been having to endure, in order to procure payment of the $4.5 trillion Wanta Plan Settlement signed in May 2006 by the President of the United States, US Supreme Court Judges, and other prominent US parties, and warmly welcomed by the Group of Eight (G-8) countries in July 2006.

    He has also been testifying in detail about the ransacking of funds that has been taking place in recent months, and the illegal activity over which Mr Henry M. Paulson has been presiding in this context. Mr Paulson, who has sole signatory power over Wanta’s hijacked $4.5 trillion, was previously the Chief Executive Officer of Goldman Sachs and Company, so that his behaviour represents the Grandfather of all US and international financial conflict-of-interest scandals.

    3. The official was required to present the Tribunal with the comprehensive data contained within the ‘data burst’ issued by the US Treasury in November [see our earlier reports], which prove that instead of the ‘data burst’ providing for the Wanta Settlement payment, the funds were being stolen and secreted offshore.








    The rest of this report is just as relevant, but was prepared overnight 29th/30th December 2006, whereas the above numbered notes were incorporated upon receipt of this updated intelligence, at around 4.00pm UK time Saturday 30th December 2006.

    The decisions of such an International Tribunal have to be adhered to, in practice, by an American official recipient of its sentencing. The German authorities have jurisdiction here because they exercised the International Court’s subpoena. But semantic quibblings over actual jurisdiction are completely irrelevant in this context, because this development is a DARK BLACK STAIN upon the international financial reputation of the United States generally (unfortunately) and especially upon the Bush Administration, which appears to be descending into chaos because of its non-payment and non-performance on the $4.5 trillion.

    We have seven separate sources for this information, including one very senior British Central Government source, two British intelligence confirmations, and three high-level well-placed US confirmations that Paulson’s arrest took place in recent days.

    Since this dramatic development, Paulson has vanished from view.

    A brief sanitised report about his meeting on 21st December with the German Finance Minister, Peer Steinbrueck, and with Chancellor Angela Merkel, appeared in several US newspapers, but there was no mention of his desperate plan to use the Wanta funds to pay 1% of $370 trillion of derivatives plus ninety-nine percent in the form of a Ten-Year Note, because this fantasy was ‘spiked’ by our last report.

    We continue below our blow-by-blow diary of this unparalleled crisis, based on intelligence to hand at the time of this posting. Given that we are led to expect ‘further and better particulars’ about Mr Paulson’s arrest, indictment, counts, alleged plea-bargaining, sentencing. obligations and sudden disappearance, we will update this posting as and when continuing research, by ourselves and well-placed financial sector associates, delivers the further expected details of this latest ‘leg’ of the dramatic ‘unrolling of events’. We will not be responding to pressure from emailers to bring forward additional information until it is to hand, and has been appropriately verified.


    What we are witnessing is the cornering of key US criminal operatives and the imminent collapse of the criminal empire that seized control of the US Federal Government and intelligence services many years ago.

    This criminal empire is now on its last desperate legs, and is watching its corrupt edifice collapse at an accelerating pace, ‘as we speak’.


    One crucial by-product of this crisis, too, is that, as was exclusively reported in our previous posting, both France and Germany have started distributing pre-stored national banknotes (denominated in French francs and deutschemarks) to their respective central banks and leading commercial banks.

    The Dutch authorities are now in the process of reintroducing Dutch guilder banknotes. We are also hearing unconfirmed reports of other EU countries introducing national banknotes, as the EU Governments hedge their bets against their Collective Currency experiment, the days of which are clearly numbered.

    This shows that the EU countries (a) never had any real confidence in their Collective Currency;
    (b) accordingly stored national banknotes against the possibility of a crisis such as has arisen as
    a consequence of the ransacking of funds by US office-holders, which is impacting the EU; and
    (c) were in fact individually and collectively engaged in a fraudulent operation. Now that national banknotes are reappearing, the European Collective Currency is doomed. The notes cannot be removed from circulation, as the general public will take fright and the crisis will develop runaway legs. The European press is waffling ‘as we speak’ about the impact of the Collective Currency on the new EU Members, without having caught on to the fact that the Collective Currency is being undermined by at least three of the EU national governments, which now fear that the derivatives crisis will destroy the Collective Currency as well as the US dollar. The Federal Reserve System has debt obligations in excess of $1,000 trillion, with the derivatives overhang (deceitfully estimated at $370 trillion) believed to aggregate at least $1,140 trillion.


    Our diary format now resumes.

    See how the crisis has developed since we last reported (on 19 December 2006):

    18 December: Investigators assert that, on the basis of the situation currently prevailing [but see below] there appeared to be no way for the US Federal authorities or the US Treasury to compel the US Treasury Secretary, Mr Hank ‘Conflict-of-Interest’ Paulson, to cease and desist from his theft of the $4.5 trillion belonging to Ambassador Leo Emil Wanta and his Commonwealth of Virginia-based corporation, AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., and to compel him to pay the funds as required by the formal agreement dated May 2006 signed by the President of the United States, the Vice President, the key Supremes and top legislators. In other words they concur that the Rule of Law in the United States, which they spend their lives seeking to uphold, has collapsed. They accordingly agree that a holder of high office can steal, pillage, ransack and lie as he pleases with impunity [again, see below]…

    18 December: The Editor of International Currency Review writes from New York to Chancellor Angela Merkel in Berlin, enclosing a copy of International Currency Review, Volume 31, Numbers 3 and 4 and the Wisconsin Taxation Gestapo Supplement, as follows:

    Bundeskanzlerin Angela Merkel
    Willi-Brandt Strasse 1
    10557 BERLIN, Germany

    Madame Chancellor

    At the request of Ambassador Leo Emil Wanta, I am enclosing herewith a copy of the latest issue of International Currency Review [Volume 31, Numbers 3 and 4], published in London, UK, which deals exclusively with the global crisis surrounding the failure of the US Treasury to credit the securities account at Morgan Stanley in New York of Ambassador Wanta with the $4.5 trillion hard dollar cash Settlement funds, in accordance with the formal agreement dated May 2006 signed by the President of the United States and other US holders of high office.

    These funds have been diverted and are held, tagged in the name of the Ambassador and his Virginia-based corporation, AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., in a US Treasury account with Goldman Sachs and Company, which has been retaining and exploiting these funds illegally.

    Henry M. Paulson, the US Treasury Secretary, who used to be C.E.O. of Goldman Sachs, has sole signatory authority over this account at Goldman Sachs that holds the diverted funds.

    The Ambassador would be grateful if you would have your staff read and absorb the postings to be found at our website, http://www.worldreports.org [Home Page ARCHIVE and CLICK HERE reports], which give details of how this crisis has developed since last June.

    The journal and the http://www.worldreports.org postings are specifically relevant and of notice to your forthcoming meeting with Henry M. Paulson, the US Treasury Secretary.

    Yours sincerely,

    Christopher Story, Editor and Publisher, International Currency Review,
    World Reports Limited, London & New York.

    19 December: Associates of Ambassador Leo Wanta and Michael C. Cottrell, M.S. , Executive Vice President and Treasurer of AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., advise that a colossal volume of US dollars is being monitored moving from Barclays Bank in the United Kingdom, to Deutsche Bank in Germany. The funds were allegedly to be used inter alia to pay down derivatives debt of the Group of Eight (G-8) countries, in accordance with the outline scheme for 1% of the inaccurately stated volume of derivatives debt outstanding ($370 trillion) to be paid out, with the remaining ninety-nine percent to be covered by a Ten-Year Note to be issued by the US Treasury under Mr Hank Paulson.

    19 December: Meanwhile the G-8 banks are continuing to pressurise the US Treasury and the US Government to pay The Wanta Plan Settlement of the $4.5 trillion. As previously explained in these postings, the Settlement would let the banks off the hook. But the way things are going at present, Ambassador Wanta will own many of the leading banks in the United States and Europe, since they hold vast sums belonging to the Ambassador, as revealed in the recently published double issue of International Currency Review [Volume 31, Numbers 3 and 4]. The list of banks holding Wanta’s accounts, published in the journal and in our posting dated 26th October 2006, is repeated below.

    19 December: Mr Henry ‘Conflict-of-Interest’ Paulson, former C.E.O. of Goldman Sachs, which is illegally holding on to Wanta’s $4.5 trillion and over which Paulson holds sole signatory power in the most obscene conflict of professional interest ever witnessed in global banking history, TO THE DISGRACE OF THE UNITED STATES GENERALLY, states openly that he will have no direct contact with Ambassador Wanta or Michael C. Cottrell, M.S.. However he also confirms earlier reports that he is ‘not sleeping well due to this mess’, which is of course entirely of his own making.

    19 December: Chinese authorities indicate that they seek to limit China’s exposure to the United States’ financial and US dollar problems, but are ready to enter to an agreement and working arrangement with Ambassador Wanta and Michael C. Cottrell, M.S. through their AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., based in the Commonwealth of Virginia [details at foot of posting].

    19 December: Associates of the Ambassador and Mr Cottrell advise that President George W. Bush has had harsh words with James Baker III.

    19 December: As we reported in the previous posting, the French and German Governments have begun reissuing national currency (French francs and deutschemarks) to their respective central and national banks. The Dutch authorities have since joined them, and are reissuing Dutch guilder banknotes. We are hearing reports of other EU countries reintroducing national banknotes.

    The significance of this development, stressed in the preceding posting, requires further decisive emphasis. The stocks of national banknotes now being distributed had been held in store, pending the possibility that the European Collective Currency might fail. It hasn’t failed yet, but the sudden reappearance of national banknotes spells the end of the Collective Currency, and probably, over the medium term, of the European Union Collective itself.

    Because these national banknotes were held in national storage all along, the collectivisation of EU currencies was manifestly fraudulent. If the Governments concerned had had absolute faith in their Collective Currency, they would not have taken the trouble to ensure that national banknotes were kept in store, against a crisis environment such as has developed consequent upon the theft of the $4.5 trillion under the US Treasury Secretary, Mr ‘Conflict-of-Interest’ Paulson, and the global financial crisis that has been ignited as result of his behaviour.

    19 December: Key European countries also make it clear that they see no need to meet with Mr Paulson, given his appalling corruption, which remains the primary subject of ongoing discussion among intelligence services and governments worldwide. In the event, the German Chancellor and the German Finance Minister, Peer Steinbrueck, are reported [21st December: see below] to have met Paulson briefly in Berlin, but press reports [e.g. Boston Globe] concerning the meeting turn out to be sparse and essentially meaningless, as though the full truth is not being told…

    19 December: Certain investigators suggest that relevant funds have been transferred. But there is no sign of the necessary transfers on bank screens.

    20 December: A letter is issued, via an associate of Leo Emil Wanta’s AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., to Chinese Government Ministers, seeking their approval of the proposed transactional agreement with the Ambassador’s AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc.

    20 December: Investigators advise that the Vatican is demanding exact specifications concerning the alleged transfer of funds that investigators said had taken place on 19th December. The Vatican is livid that it has been lied to.

    20 December: An Attorney associated with AmeriTrust Groupe, informs the Ambassador and Michael C. Cottrell, M.S. that Senator Grassley’s office staff have commented that ‘$4.5 trillion is too much money for one person’. This tired refrain has been heard on and off for several months, but it is malicious and irrelevant on three counts. First, Ambassador Wanta is just about the ONLYexpert individual in the United States who can definitively be trusted to handle the $4.5 trillion Settlement funds conscientiously and honestly: no-one else on the stage could be trusted with such funds.

    So what this imputation means is that those giving vent to this assertion are inverting the situation: they know that they themselves could never be trusted with such funds, so they seek to imply that the Ambassador cannot be trusted either – which is a libellous implied accusation, given that the Ambassador’s record is impeccable, not least as clearly revealed in International Currency Review Volume 31, 3 and 4 [distributed in December 2006].

    Secondly, this malicious statement seeks to undermine the formal agreement signed by the US ‘Great and the Good’ in May 2006. The short answer to this piece of insolence is that if the Ambassador had not been precisely the person who CAN be trusted, the Settlement agreement would never have been signed. Thirdly, if Mr Grassley ever had genuine reservations, he should have made his position known before the accord was signed in May 2006. To seek to undermine it (which he cannot do) after the event is facile, shifty disingenuous and duplicitous.

    20 December: President Bush admits that he will have to pay Ambassador Wanta/AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., as he needs the money for Iraq.

    20 December: Certain US bankers, petrified that they will be named personally in AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. and World Reports postings because of their complicity in the criminal financial operations that we are uncovering almost ‘in real time’, resort to the familiar behaviour of crooks and bullies, and start attacking certain investigators. They fear that they will be fired or may be indicted for conspiracy to defraud AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc.; and indeed the longer that these abominations continue, the greater the likelihood that they will indeed be slammed: and rightly so.

    20 December: All of a sudden, President George W. Bush and Vice President Cheney are letting it be known that they are trying to satisfy the payment of the $4.5 trillion earmarked for The Wanta Plan, tagged in the name of the Ambassador and his AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. and which is located at Goldman Sachs in a C.H.I.P.S. account with Citibank. In addition to their need for funds ‘for Iraq’, the evolution of events herein is also being taken into serious consideration at the highest levels.

    20 December: European associates advise that certain Talk Shows in Europe, as well as surveys among bankers and officials, indicate support for the Wanta Plan, concurring that ‘Leo Wanta and Cottrell are not crazy and should be paid’. No-one in banking or official circles has ever suggested as much: absurdities like that are the speciality of second-rate, intelligence-linked operatives posing as objective commentators on Internet websites.

    20 December: In fulfilment of a longstanding intention, which was postponed some years earlier, Iran is reported to be accepting the European Collective Currency in lieu of US dollars, in payment for its exported petroleum. (The way things are going, the Iranians will probably start accepting deutschemarks or French francs once these national currencies are traded again, as seems now to be only a matter of time. The clock cannot be put back again: the national currencies released into national circulation cannot be scooped up and put back into store. The genie is out of the bottle and the days of the EU Collective Currency are numbered. This was never intended at the outset of this crisis, but it has happened).

    20 December: Democratic Party insiders advise associates of Ambassador Wanta and Mr Cottrell that Mr Hank’ Conflict-of-Interest’ Paulson will soon be dismissed due to his non-payment of the $4.5 trillion and his non-performance. But as will be seen below, the White House and Treasury are now completely at the mercy of the cascading events that Paulson’s criminality has unleashed.


    21 December: Associates of Ambassador Wanta and Michael C. Cottrell, M.S. advise that given the insistent demands from Group of Eight (G-8) countries for the agreed Wanta Plan Settlement to be implemented forthwith, and given Mr Paulson’s criminal non-performance, the White House seems to be in complete disarray, with no-one in that building having the slightest idea what to do, even though they know very well what they have to do.

    22 December: Associates of Ambassador Wanta and Michael C. Cottrell, M.S., advise that American Treasury personnel have completed test runs with respect to the prospective US dollar deficits for 2007, and that the results consistently reveal the prospect of deficits that will be much higher than predictions, and that the numbers are considered to be ‘very scary’.

    It will of course be recalled from our earlier postings that if The Wanta Plan had been implemented with effect from June or early July 2006 as originally intended (before Paulson diverted the funds), the US Treasury would ALREADY have accrued tax windfall income of the order of $13-$14 trillion, so that the kinds of numbers that US Treasury boffins have been looking at ARE COMPLETELY INEXCUSABLE, AND REPRESENT A GROSS DERELICTION OF OFFICIAL DUTY ON THE PART OF THE PRESENT U.S. ADMINISTRATION, GIVEN THE ‘UNIVERSAL’ FINANCIAL SOLUTION TO THE UNITED STATES’ GHASTLY FINANCING PROBLEMS REPRESENTED BY THE WANTA PLAN.

    The US Treasury Secretary has sabotaged the Treasury’s own finances, perpetuating the US deficit financing orgy when it should have taken the corrective action agreed in May 2006.

    • The EURONEXT electronic settlement system will be operational and will be heavily used immediately it comes on stream on 1st January, providing the Rest of the World with yet another reason to abandon the self-inflicted US financial morass.

    22 December: In a separate exercise, investigators perform a detailed examination of the factors surrounding non-payment of the Wanta Settlement, taking into account the actions of the White House Chief of Staff (Josh Bolten) and President George W. Bush himself. They conclude that everyone and everything pointed directly to Mr Henry’ Conflict-of-Interest’ Paulson being, to employ the phrase used, ‘at the apex of the screw-up’. (This was apparent many postings ago).

    22 December: Associates of AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., assert that Paulson has been advised by ‘high authorities’ that ‘he will be protected’. British intelligence sources carefully advise the Editor of International Currency Review that Mr ‘Conflict-of-Interest’ Paulson ‘works for George Bush Sr.’.

    22 December: Ambassador Leo Wanta writes to James Baker III, Florida Governor Jeb Bush, President George W. Bush Jr., Vice President Richard Cheney, US Special Counsel Patrick J. Fitzgerald, Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, Henry M. Paulson himself, First Lady Laura Bush, Mrs Lynn Cheney, Republican National Committee Chairman Ed Gillespie, and other senior officials, offering the expert services of Michael C. Cottrell, M.S., as Treasurer of AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc, to assist the Office of the President in a practical manner with the simple resolution of this crisis. Mr Wanta’s straightforward letter reiterates that: ‘We at AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., stand ready and capable to regenerate the Department of the Treasury, without further questionable delay ‘of others}. Mr President, just simply call Mike at 814-874 3257 and we [can] move discreetly forward without needless fanfare and political situations’.

    The Ambassador concludes with appropriate Christmas greetings to the President and his family.

    22 December: Investigators advise that FIVE German banks are now ready to disburse funds, and that all they need is Mr Henry Paulson’s approval.

    [Note: The German banks, like those in all the other G-8 countries and beyond, are DESPERATE for this matter to be settled once and for all, so that the underlying $27.5 trillion which is OWNED BY Ambassador Wanta and resident in the myriad bank accounts relisted below are, not called. They are aware that moves have been made since early December for the banks’ illegally held Wanta funds to be handed over, and they seek to hold on to them (or rather to covert their own illegal financing operations to a form of international ‘legality’) in order to remain afloat].


    [On 24th December, British intelligence informed the Editor of International Currency Review as follows: ‘I have heard that he (Paulson) was caught red-handed and that he may have been brought before an informal tribunal… I cannot therefore confirm the intelligence at this time, save as to Paulson’s imminent retirement, but I will make further inquiries’. On 27th December, the same UK intelligence source elaborated that: ‘Ad hoc tribunal very likely, 12 months’ house arrest and resignation being talked about: he should go early in the New Year’. On 29th December, UK intelligence repeated that this information was being widely discussed in intelligence circles].


    22 December: Associates advise that certain powerful British official figures are extremely concerned about Paulson’s non-payment of the $4.5 trillion to AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., having finally realised that the official sabotaging of agreed payments jeopardises the continued fragile viability of the international financial system generally.

    The relevant UK figures (MPs and officials) are reported to have strongly advised the US Government that Mr Paulson needs to be dismissed. The implication is that they fear that his criminal behaviour may call the viability of the entire international financial system into question: and in this, they are dead right.

    (Memo to the MPs and officials concerned: We could have used your assistance months ago, when we were fighting this battle for global financial integrity, sanity and a decisive end to international money corruption almost entirely alone).

    22 December: Investigators file an official report to the US Government confirming the non-payment of the $4.5 trillion Wanta Plan Settlement funds, and the theft of the funds within the US Treasury/Federal Reserve System.

    The scandal has therefore reached, shall we say, ‘an advanced stage of maturity’, and now has the clear potential to bring the mesmerised Bush II Administration to its knees.

    This was never anyone’s intention. If a collapse occurs, it will be entirely the fault of the criminal cadres’ seizure of the Wanta Settlement funds.

    24 December: Another ‘Wanta can’t be trusted to handle $4.5 trillion’ whammy, this time from ignorant White House officials trying belatedly to justify their collective criminality. ‘Leo Wanta’, they say, ‘is not qualified to handle that sort of money’. How curious, then, that he was entrusted (a) with handling the $27.5 trillion raised from 200+ international banks in 1989-92 and (b) with a United Nations contract worth $5 trillion (stolen from him by the Clintons [continued below].

    [This took place after they had collaborated with the Wisconsin Department of Revenue to ‘take Wanta down’ for non-payment of an illegally-raised State tax charge of $14,129 which he had paid TWICE under protest: see the 24-page ICR Supplement distributed worldwide with International Currency Review, Volume 31, Numbers 3 and 4, entitled Wisconsin Taxation Gestapo Fraud. This proves gross corruption by the Wisconsin tax authorities, and virtually assures that this State will have to be taken over in due course by a Federal Trust, not least since the tax authorities there may be scamming innumerable other State taxpayers as well as the Ambassador.

    AND YOU WON'T BELIEVE THIS: Notwithstanding that Leo has paid the illegal tax demand for $14,129 THREE TIMES already, the Wisconsin tax authorities issued a further demand for the SAME amount on 30th October 2006. In December 2006, International Currency Review published the 24-page Supplement which PROVES Wisconsin State tax fraud in this case. On 30th December, Ambassador Leo Wanta received yet ANOTHER demand for THE SAME (itemised) $14,129.00 illegally charged but paid TWICE under protest in 1992, and paid a third time in July 2005.

    We will have to post a description of the Wisconsin State Tax Gestapo Fraud and how it has been perpetuated, at an appropriate opportunity, because it seems that the step-by-step, diagrammatic presentation in the Supplement has not yet penetrated the thick skulls of the corrupt Wisconsin Department of Revenue's officials, notably a Mr Frazier. The Editor spoke to this apparatchik in November and pointed out that the illegally charged $14,129 had been paid under protest THREE TIMES ALREADY; whereupon Mr Frazier, the Department's audit chief said TWICE: 'I'll have to look into it'. He obviously didn't. So this dimension of the corruption crisis will have to be tackled with renewed vigour, starting with an expose replicating the fraudit trail from the Supplement].

    Of course, the officials at the White House who are reverting to this alibi [see above] have had access to the special double issue of International Currency Review, so they have no excuse at all for their stupidity and arrogance on this score. They risk being named along with corrupt bankers (see below) if this matter is not brought to a speedy overdue conclusion.

    27 December: While investigators and associates of the Ambassador and Mr Cottrell advise that ‘there will be very little activity this week, with the funds supposedly to be moved during the first week of 2007, British intelligence sources advise the Editor of International Currency Review that, on the contrary, frenetic trading activity has been monitored during the holidays.

    27 December: Associates of Ambassador Wanta and Michael C. Cottrell, M.S., advise that non-payment of The Wanta Plan Settlement, which was the main topic of behind-the-scenes discussions at the St Petersburg Group of Eight (G-8) Summit last July, is now the talk of the entire world among intelligence, government and banking circles – everywhere, that is, with the single exception of the United States, where the controlled and compliant ‘mainstream media’ has lacked the bottle to report the biggest financial/corruption crisis facing the American Republic since its Revolution.

    27 December: Associates of the Ambassador, Mr Cottrell, and the Editor advise separately that Mr Henry Paulson was arrested in Germany and brought before an ‘Ad Hoc Tribunal’ under German jurisdiction. An earlier report stated that he was seized and placed in shackles, hauled before the Tribunal, and sentenced to the equivalent of ten years’ incarceration on a tariff of one year per count, but that he had lawyers ‘plea-bargain’ the counts down so that he was sentenced to one year’s house arrest, must resign his post (or be sacked) , and must pay the $4.5 trillion Settlement.

    27 December: The United Arab Emirates starts selling 8% of its US dollar holdings, an amount thought to be worth $25 billion, in exchange for Euros.

    27 December: It is confirmed to the Ambassador from Vienna that the Austrian Government will be pleased to accept a windfall taxation payment of $1.575 trillion by way of full satisfaction of the corporate tax payable on Wanta’s $4.5 trillion. At 50%, the Austrian Government could extract $2.25 trillion, but this offer is made at this time in order to confirm that it will be happy to proceed as we first reported on 2nd October, since the US Treasury seems reluctant to accept the $1.575 trillion which will become payable immediately on remittance of the Settlement. The Austrian Government lodges this claim in response to Leo Wanta’s earlier offer, given the US Government’s criminal non-performance. It will be recalled that Ambassador Leo Wanta has been a legal resident (approved by the Austrian Court) of the Republic of Austria since June 1988. It is therefore open to Mr Wanta to reside in Austria and to conduct his affairs from that country.

    28 December: We now begin to hear talk, via a CIA Attorney associated with the Ambassador, of another reason that is being wheeled out to ‘justify’ the official criminality retrospectively – namely that the Ambassador, Mr Cottrell and AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc, will become ‘too powerful’. This latest alibi is on a par with the ‘Leo Wanta can’t handle $4.5 trillion’ ruse, and is susceptible to the same criticism. In particular, Senators and others bringing forward this alibi are far too late. They should, like Senator Grassley, have made their views known earlier, before the May 2006 agreement was signed off. Where have they been all these months? Have their staffers and the spooks embedded with them been withholding the facts from them? Answer: You bet. They need to weed out these enemies of America PDQ. In any case, this belated alibi depends for any validity upon the unspoken and libellous assumption that Ambassador Wanta is not to be trusted (like them).

    • The reverse is of course the case: he is the ONLY man who can be trusted to handle such funds appropriately, as his record (exposed in International Currency Review) manifestly shows, to all who are not deliberately sitting on their brains. It is typical of those with warped mentalities to transfer their own weaknesses on to their ‘enemies’.

    28 December: Associates of the Ambassador and Michael C. Cottrell, M.S., confirm that high-level written British representations have been made directly to the White House, demanding payment of the Wanta Plan Settlement in full. The strong implication is that if this matter is not resolved without further delay, there is going to be an almighty open financial and global economic crisis, rather than the crisis remaining contained (just) within official, intelligence and banking circles, as has been the case to date. Note that the British are DEMANDING settlement, not ASKING.

    28 December: European associates inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., that the letter dated 15th December to the White House and our posting dated 19th December has created a firestorm in Europe. Ambassador Wanta and Mr Cottrell are becoming quite widely known, are being discussed on Talk Shows, and are receiving coverage in the French press.

    28 December: In a further sign of the earth moving beneath the criminal fraternity in Washington, huge chunks of gold bullion and US dollars (with an estimate of an initial tranche worth $45 billion) have been transferred from China to British custody, for the purpose of asset diversification, as the Chinese authorities set about seeking to diversify their US dollar holdings.

    28 December: Given the now certain demise of the Federal Reserve System [see previous posting], it is confirmed that an Act of Congress will be passed to delete all references to the Federal Reserve from all dollar bills.

    • Memo to the new Congress: Please make sure that when you do this, you DELETE the offensive occult images from the $1.0 bill, which cause immense offence to millions of Americans. This would be the greatest gift you could give to the United States, which, when the Wanta Settlement is effective, will turn a corner and will enter an entirely new phase of prosperity characterised by the systematic paydown of the US Treasury’s colossal background debt, thought to exceed $50 trillion (if all categories of official debt are properly computed).

    Furthermore, final payment and initiation of the Wanta Plan $4.5 trillion will represent a decisive break with the corrosive environment of official criminality which is well on the way to destroying the American Republic, as we have pointed out in earlier reports. We will see how weak and feeble this new Congress is going to be, or whether it will rise to the challenge it faces. If it does, it will certainly go down in history as the most historic Congress since the Republic’s foundation.

    28 December: Experts confirm that all assets of the US Federal Reserve are on the auction block in Europe for a total value of $450 billion, ALTHOUGH THE FED’S DEBTS ACTUALLY EXCEED $1,000 TRILLION. As previously mentioned, the estimated correct size of the derivatives overhang is of the order of $1,140 trillion.

    The Fed’s assets are being sold off in a pre-closure ‘Fire Sale’.

    28 December: Colossal volumes of US dollar-denominated funds have been covertly sent from US banks to ISRAELI BANKS by Goldman Sachs and Company and Mr Henry ‘Conflict-of-Interest’ Paulson, one purpose being to hide funds from Ambassador Wanta. The idea is that these funds can be frozen in Israel, on the assumption that the US would never go to war with that country.

    Sources raise the question as to whether Mr Paulson has fled to Israel. There has been no confirmation of this.

    28 December: Additional amounts of dollar funds are stated by investigators to be in place ready to be paid out via Citibank to bank accounts in Paraguay, held in the names of current US holders of high office. This gives credence to detailed reports which have been circulating for many weeks, concerning the purchase by Bush family interests of a 100,000 acre property in Paraguay, which is conveniently located adjacent to a US military installation, the Mariscal Estigarribia Air Base to which US Special Forces have access, and where US military assets are based. It is also adjacent
    to a huge tract of land purchased by Sun Myung Moon which sits astride the Guarani aquifer, the largest in Latin America.

    This ‘inside financial information’ suggests that the ‘Paraguay option’ is now being geared up for realisation, so that the Bush Family (real name of George Bush Sr.: Scherff) can escape. Before the emergence of this information, we were reluctant to incorporate this dimension into our blow-by-blow reports on this millennial crisis. But it now seems more than likely that, having ransacked all possible funds, these crooks have prepared for themselves a heavily defended bolt-hole. This seems extremely stupid, given that a US Government of a different persuasion would, in such circumstances, be perfectly entitled to invade Paraguay to seize the criminals and bring them to trial, as well as to procure access to their stolen assets.

    28 December: Attorney Thomas E. Henry writes to The Honorable George W. Bush Jr., President, United States of America, White House, 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, Washington DC 20220: Transmitted by email attachment and United States mail:

    Re: Apparent Circumvention and Avoidance of Agreed Upon Financial Settlement regarding Leo E. Wanta/Lee E. Wanta and AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc.

    Dear Mr. President:

    It is respectfully requested that immediate attention be given to the matter addressed in this letter. Irrespective of participation and knowledge of the referenced settlement agreement by several American and foreign interests, (both in the public and private sector), official(s) in your Administration are pursuing an agenda contrary to the ‘rule of law’ and in direct circumvention
    of the agreed upon settlement.

    The Honorable Henry M. Paulson, Jr., United States Department of the Treasury, is either unilaterally and/or in conspiracy with others (known and unknown), refusing to follow the ‘rule
    of law’ and complete financial obligations negotiated and approved by all concerned parties and parties of interest in the referenced (”Re”) matter.

    On December 15, 2006 Secretary Paulson was advised in writing that failure to comply with terms and conditions of the agreed upon settlement constitutes a violation of the Securities Acts of 1933, 1934 and the Organized Crime Control Act of 1970, specifically R.I.C.O. Additionally, Secretary Paulson was advised of H.R. 3723 that summarily provides that corporate business activity is protected under the Economic and Industrial Espionage Laws of the United States of America
    and the International Economic Community.

    All concerned parties are aware that Secretary Paulson, under his personal signature, has control over referenced settlement agreement funds located at Goldman Sachs, et. al., (C.H.I.P.S.) account with CITIBANK NYC. It is believed that Secretary Paulson, in violation of his oath of office when accepting a position in your Cabinet with responsibility to the United States Department of the Treasury, is avoiding his legal and ethical obligations to complete the transfer of the referenced settlement agreement funds and apparently favoring a private business relationship with his previous employer. This conflict of interest position and Secretary Paulson’s former relationship with Goldman Sachs provides the formidable basis for the assertion of a violation of the Securities Acts and Organized Crime Control Act of 1970.

    This matter requires your immediate intervention and direction to enable mitigation of a very volatile situation with the potential of serious impact on the global economy. The principals in this matter continually reaffirm their allegiance to the United States of America and specifically the office of the President of the United States.

    Sincerely yours, Thomas E. Henry.

    Copied to: President of the United States George W. Bush Jr., president@whitehouse.gov;
    Vice President Cheney, vice_president@whitehouse.gov; Patrick J. Fitzgerald, Patrick.j.fitzgerald@doj.gov; James A. Baker III, bipp@rice.edu; Ambassador Lee E. Wanta;
    Michael C. Cottrell, M.S., treasurere, AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc.

    29 December: Reliable investigative sources inform Mr Cottrell that if Paulson fails to effect the Wanta payment in short order, he risks being rearrested anywhere outside the United States and slammed without further ado into a European prison for 15 years. High-level UK parliamentary and Downing Street sources confirm that the US Treasury Secretary has been arrested and sentenced.

    The highest-level UK source indicates his intention of obtaining the Tribunal Court documents, which will be available shortly. Thanks to this statement, we obtain final definitive confirmation of the arrest. (By now, we have acquired seven separate sources, one of which we cannot begin to identify at this time. Two are in the process of obtaining documentary details, which may or may not be made available in time for posting. It is not known whether such documentation will be available for posting at all: this depends upon sources and what is legally permitted).

    29 December: Since Goldman Sachs and Company has been engaged in criminal financial retention and exploitation of Ambassador Leo Emil Wanta’s funds without his approval, the Board of Directors of that institution are severally and collectively responsible for this criminal financial activity, in collaboration with Mr Henry ‘Conflict-of-Interest’ Paulson, their former C.E.O. himself.

    As of November 2006, the Board of Directors of Goldman Sachs and Company consisted of the following individuals and operatives: Lloyd C. Blankfein, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer; Gary D. Cohn, President and Co-Chief Operating Officer; John Winkelried, President and Chief Operating Officer; Lord Brown of Madingley, Chairman of British Petroleum; John H. Bryan; Claes Dahlback; Stephen Friedman; William W. George; Rajat K. Gupta; James A. Johnson; Lois D. Jubiler; Edward M. Liddy; Ruth J. Simmons; and John F. W. Rogers, Secretary to the Board.

    29 December: A British Airways jet conveying Tony Blair and most of his family to Miami, encounters an ‘accident’ on arrival at Miami Airport over the Christmas holidays. Blair’s intelligence profile reveals him to be afraid of flying. The Editor is informed that this ‘incident’ was NOT an accident.

    Blair has been under pressure to leave Downing Street and ‘should have left’ by the end of March 2006. He and members of his family were reported to be staying at the Miami home of one Robin Gibb, said to be a ‘Bee Gees’ pop ‘star’. The Times, London [29th December] describes Mrs Gibb as ‘a bisexual Druid priestess from Northern Ireland’, which seems about the Prime Minister’s level.

    • He is supposed to be in Miami ‘on holiday’, but in reality he is allegedly engaged in financial negotiations and operations in the heart of US criminal country, where various well-known high-level and military-linked crooks operate. It is unlikely that he is ‘singing from the same hymn sheet’ as the top British Government official who sent that Memo to the White House DEMANDING immediate settlement of The Wanta Plan payment.


    In case the massive proportions of the problem collectively facing banks that have been using Ambassador Leo Wanta’s base $27.5 trillion to stay afloat is not yet sufficiently well understood, we conclude with a repeat of the list of banks holding Wanta assets, taken from our posting dated 26th October 2006. This list is compiled from the list of banks and Wanta financial transactions to be found on pages 306-309 of International Currency review, Volume 31, Numbers 3 & 4 [480 pages]. The relevant banking etc documents are reproduced on pages 310 to 430.

    AB Invest [Avenue Banque]
    ABN-AMRO Bank N.V., Amsterdam,
    Agape Holdings, Ltd, Barbados
    Agricultural Bank of China
    Algemene Spaar-en Lufrentenkas
    Algemene Spaar-en Lufrentenkas/ASLK Bank
    Altalanos Eriekforgalmi Bank Rt (AEB RT)
    Amsouth Bank, N.A
    Amur Commercial Bank, Moscow
    Anglo Manx Bank Limited
    Arab Jordan Investment Bank
    Australia & New Zealand Banking Group Limited, Melbourne
    Bacob Savings Bank, Borgerhout, Belgium
    Banca di Roma, Rome
    Banca Nazionale del Lavoro
    Banco Ambrosiano Veneto
    Banco Espanol de Credito, S.A., Madrid
    Banco Espirito Santo e Comerciale de Lisboa, Lisbon
    Banco Exterior de Espana, Madrid
    Banco Hispano Americano
    Bangko Sentral ng Pilipinas
    Bank ‘UKRAINA’, Kiev, Ukraine
    Bank Bruxelles Lambert
    Bank Crozier Limited, Grenada [closed down, money stolen]
    Bank Dumesnil, Geneva
    Bank for Foreign Economic Affairs of the USSR, Moscow
    Bank of America
    Bank of America International, New York
    Bank of America, Milan
    Bank of America, Newport Beach, CA
    Bank of America, Vienna, Austria
    Bank of China
    Bank of New York, New York
    Bank of Tokyo-Mitsubishi, Ltd, Tokyo
    Bank Union de Crédit
    Bankers Trust GmbH, Frankfurt
    Banque Nationale de Paris
    Banque Paribas (Luxembourg) S.A
    Banque SCS ALLIANCE Geneva
    Banque Suisse de Crédit et de Dépôts, Zürich
    Barclays Bank, Hanover Square, London
    CBI-TDB Union Bancaire Privée, Geneva
    Chase Manhattan Bank N.A., London,
    Chase Manhattan Bank, Milan
    Chase Manhattan Bank, New York
    Chase Manhattan Bank, Vienna
    Chemical Bank of New York
    Citibank – Frankfurt
    Citibank – Geneva
    Citibank – Los Angeles
    Citibank – Milan
    Citibank – New York
    Citibank – Singapore
    Citibank – Tokyo
    Citibank – Vienna, Austria
    Citibank, N.A., Philippines
    Citicorp/Citibank, London, Painewebber, Inc
    Clydesdale Bank Plc
    Commercial Bank ‘Moldova-Agroindbank’, S.A., Kishinev
    Coutts Bank (Switzerland) Ltd
    Coutts Bank, London
    Crédit Lynonnais Bank Nederland NV, Amsterdam
    Crédit Suisse Bank
    Crédit Suisse Bank, Geneva
    Crédit Suisse Bank, Lausanne
    Crédit Suisse First Boston, Zürich
    Credobank (Commercial Bank)
    DBS Bank/Development Bank of Singapore: This bank was closed down by the Singapore authorities and $70 billion belonging to/controlled by Ambassador Wanta was stolen in the process.
    Dean Witter Reynolds
    Den Norske Bank AS, Oslo
    Deutsche Bank, Düsseldorf
    Dresdner Bank, Frankfurt
    Faroe Investments
    FIDENAS AG, Zürich, Switzerland
    Générale de Banque
    Gosbank, USSR
    Handels Bank AG, Zürich
    Handelsbank Natwest, Zürich
    Hansabank, Talinn, Estonia
    Joint Stock Bank ‘Kazkommertsbank’, Almaty
    Jugobanka D.D
    Lloyds Bank Plc
    Lloyds Bank Plc, Aylesbury, Buckinghamshire
    [funds placed in the personal name of Jan Morton Heger]
    Manufacturers Hanover Corporation/Mantrust
    Marshall and Ilsley Bank
    Merita Bank, Helsinki
    Merrill Lynch Inc
    Midland Bank Plc, London
    Morgan Guaranty & Trust Bank, New York
    Morgan Stanley and Co, New York
    Morgan Stanley Asia Ltd, Hong Kong
    Moscow Cooperative Bank ‘Partner’ Bank
    Moscow Narodny Bank Ltd, Singapore
    Mosstrolbank, AmeriTrust Corporation Inc.
    National Bank for Foreign Economic Activity of the Republic of Uzbekistan, Tashkent,
    National Westminster Bank
    National Westminster Bank of New Jersey
    National Westminster Bank Plc., Herne Bay, Kent
    Nomura Singapore Limited
    Nordbanken AB, Stockholm
    Northern Trust International Banking Corporation
    Norwest Bank, N.A
    Ost-West Handelsbank, Frankfurt
    Painewebber, Inc
    Paribas (Suisse) S.A., Geneva
    Philadelphia International Bank
    Prudential Securities, New York
    Raffeisen Zentralbank Osterreich, Vienna
    Raffeisenbank Appenzell
    Rafffeisen Zentralbank Osterreich AG [RBZ], Singapore
    Relvnesheconombank, Minsk
    Rigas Komerc Banka, Riga, Latvia
    Royal Bank of Scotland Plc
    Royal Trust Bank
    Sanwa Bank Limited
    Sanwa Bank Lt, Düsseldorf
    Schweizerische Bankgesellshaft /Union Bank of Switzerland
    Security Pacific Asia Bank, Ltd
    Shearson Lehman Hutton Inc., Denver
    Société Générale, Paris
    Société Générale, Riga, Latvia
    Southwest Securities, Inc
    Standard Chartered Bank, Philippines
    State Bank for Foreign Economic Affairs for Turkmenistan
    Status-Credit Bank, Moscow
    Swiss Banking Corporation
    Swiss Volksbank, Zürich
    Texas Commerce Bank, Dallas
    Toronto Dominion Bank
    Unibank A.S., Copenhagen
    Union Bank of Switzerland, Geneva
    Union Bank of Switzerland, Zürich
    Vilniaus Bank AS, AB, Vilnius, Lithuania
    Volksbank, Bonn, Germany
    Volksbank, Offerdingen, Germany
    Westdeutsche Landesbank, Düsseldorf, Germany
    Zentralsparkasse und Kommerzialbank, Vienna.

    *Self-evidently, some of these institutions have since been absorbed into other institutions, have been rebranded, or have otherwise become successor organisations since Wanta was illegally ‘taken down’ 1993. The successor organisations are responsible for the Wanta Title 18, Section 6 corporate accounts and the assets they contain, inherited from the institutions that merged with them. Comprehensive details of the ACTUAL TRANSACTIONS, BANK ACCOUNTS AND COORDINATES, has been published in International Currency Review, Volume 31, 3/4 [December 2006]. See http://www.worldreports.org for subscription information.

    • Recall that the CIA promulgated the lie that Ambassador Wanta was DEAD. When he ‘ceased’ to be dead in July 2005, the liars were caught in their own web of deceit.

    • Uninformed commentators are continuing to speculate wildly and inaccurately about the facts of the Wanta case. These are available IN BLACK, WHITE AND RED in the 480-page issue of International Currency Review cited here. World Reports Limited is a private UK commercial organisation with no subsidies or financial assistance whatsoever, so we cannot possibly distribute this hugely expensive-to-produce document without payment.

    However to those who indulge in ill-informed speculation without the facts, we suggest that you should take special care now, because the detailed information which answers almost all outstanding ‘Wanta questions’ has been ‘out there’ since early December. If you haven’t seen and absorbed International Currency Review Volume 31, Numbers 3 and 4 (and preferably also ICR Volume 30, Numbers 2 and 3, February 2005, which reproduced the Federal Reserve print-outs concerning the original $27.5 trillion of funds entrusted to Leo Wanta’s care), you are NOT INFORMED and all speculation and waffle without such basic data is, by definition, not credible. So, if you need to ask questions, make sure that you have read, absorbed and properly understood this openly published intelligence information FIRST. Otherwise you are wasting your own and everyone else’s time.

    •Note: Should some people wonder why the Ambassador has CIA-linked lawyers, the position in the United States is that people in this position have lawyers ‘imposed upon them’. It’s just one of the quirks and stupidities of the collapsing ‘system’.


    Ambassador Leo Emil Wanta: Diplomatic Passport Numbers 04362 & 12535 a.k.a. Frank B. Ingram [FBI] (Sector V) SA32NV; and a.k.a. Rick Reynolds, SA233MS. AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc: Federal EIN Number 20-3866855; Virginia State Corporation Identification Number: 0617454-4; Virginia State Department of Taxation Identification Number: 30203866855F001.


  93. Cyclohexane January 2, 2007 12:21 pm

    Serious deflation will never occur because the political consequences for the USG would be so severe.

    Thus, from a political perspective, the USG cannot and will not ever allow deflation, rather it will inflate and inflate to ensure that people feel “rich”.

    Bet on inflation, not deflation.

  94. kia January 2, 2007 1:39 pm

    PB45, (#56) Do you have any links to the Wanta story. I’d be curious to know what you have read.


  95. larry January 2, 2007 3:07 pm

    89 muleskinner…that tune takes me back…luv it…i am now lookin up’hang me from the highest treee,women won’t ya wait for me!’

  96. larry January 2, 2007 3:10 pm

    kia…compliment…i did’nt realize you were of the NAM era,,,,good you are young at heart…best luck to all in the new year…..i think we’ll need it…oh and god bless our government?they know not what they do???

  97. kia January 2, 2007 4:42 pm

    Brother Larry,

    The government has but one function and they know exactly what they are doing

    Privatize Profit
    Socialize Cost.

    Deep Throat taught me all I needed to know “Follow the Money”, qui bono.

    If you want any changes then you must remove their priviledges, no separate pension or health care plans. No golf trips to Scotland.

    Just let them face the same system we do with K Street’s money in their backpocket.

    I am a realist, the Constitution was established for the protection of capital. That’s why they call it capitalism. If you want change the world then you have to reward someone else other that the shareholder.

    The Bill of Rights was established to protect the individual against the power of capital. That’s why they are taking them away.

    That’s the cosmic joke because as Pogo sez “We have met the enemy and he is us.”


  98. mikeck44 January 2, 2007 4:59 pm

    In case PB45 doesn’t get back on, here is a link to the Wanta story. http://www.worldreports.org/news

    Saturday 30 December 2006 20:05

    One has to wonder how something this big could be kept quite if there were any truth to the story. Time will tell.

  99. nukem January 2, 2007 5:17 pm

    A) Inflation - excess Federal Reserve Notes - price of X goes up, but since my income doesn’t keep pace with inflation, I can’t afford X.

    B) Deflation - shortage of Federal Reserve Notes - price of X stays the same or goes down, but since FRN’s are scarce, I can’t afford X.

    Both can hurt people’s ability to buy what they need.

    Will there really be a shortage of Federal Reserve Notes? I doubt it very much!

  100. Karl Peters January 2, 2007 6:46 pm

    I would like to address the following statement you make in your article:

    “There is an old saying that you can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make him drink… In spite of what Bernanke says, the Fed does not “print” money. It must loan it into existence, but this requires willing borrowers. ”

    This is true. But you forget one very important fact. Uncle Sam is the most willing borrower of last resort. when every homeowner has gone bankrupt, every corporation has ceased borrowing for lack of profitable opportunities to expand, the government always stands ready to borrow limitless sums of money to build bombs and blow up people and things.

    This is how the Great Depression was ended, and I have no doubt Bush and Bernanke would be willing to do the same again if needed.

  101. larry January 2, 2007 6:59 pm

    kia…you mean…socialize profit and privatize cost…….ohhhhh…i know what ya mean,,,,yukyukyuuuuuk

  102. larry January 2, 2007 7:03 pm

    97 nukum…nailed it…..A) plus B)=a+…..that is actually getting written in my spiral notebook on financial stuff…well said nukum

  103. PB45 January 2, 2007 8:07 pm

    Hello posters,
    Kia you expressed an interest in Ambassador Leo Wanta. I have an archive of material for your use. It is long and complex, but in total is indisbutable.
    The web link MikeCk provided is a very good start. The Global Analyst is a very well respected and connected English think tank of sorts. It is expensive, but the author has picked up the cudgels for the persecuted, jailed and discredited Ambassadoe Wanta.
    Here is the complete web of archives on the subject.So you can follow the chronology of his saga. Wanta is no innocent bystander as he was a CIA operative of black ops vs Russia, the Iran contra affair, but a loyal, honest and trusted ally to Pres. Ronald Regan. Regan’s set up he AmeriTrust to avoid the ominous downfall and misuse of SSS funds held in trust for US citizens. As presidet he deposited approx 11 Trn USD$ in 200 European Banks. The interst since 1989 compounded to 37 trillion toatl which is to be turnover to the IRS for tax payment and reverted to Treasury NOT Fed control. http://www.worldreports.org/news
    The next webs by various investigators, writers and all non related observers will serve as evidence of Wanta’s intentions and his validity of the AmeriTrust funds. He is unbuyable, uncorruptable and even quite forgiving. Try these first I have much corraboration. regards/peter
    December 9th, 2006 at 10:08 am

  104. John L. Smith January 2, 2007 8:07 pm

    OK, I’ll vote for Ludwig.

    I want to know how people so smart as Ben, and the millions of other bankers around the world are planning to secure the future of themselves and their own kids. I really don’t think they believe this $#1T they preach, and sure they have plenty of gold coins at home, but we live in an electronic age, and gold is not very handy for international credit card transactions.

    If I were driving the Fed right now, I would be racking my brain as to just how to create a new system, new currency, new paradigm, whatever it takes, so the electronic game can continue.

    I’m sure Ben and his own, are much smarter than I, so how could they not be making such provisions. In WWII they had the Swiss Franc. Will that work this time? I doubt it.

    What will it be? What provisions will they be making? ETFs on Gold, Silver, Platinum. Honey, Uranium, Clean Water?

    We all know it takes both a good monetary commodity and a lot of confidence to make the game spin. We need a new one. What will it be? Will the Australian Dollar (or the Kiwi) be broad enough to accommodate that clan’s life savings? I doubt it. We all know the game is up if we don’t come up with a new paradigm, or some
    other way to keep the electronic money game going.

    Europe had a similar dead end to face population wise in the 16th century, then the Americas were discovered, which gave planet earth a whole new lease of life. What could possibly happen to save us this time?

    There probably are sound answers to these questions, but I don’t know what they are.

  105. Pharmboy January 2, 2007 8:15 pm

    Then again, there’s always the alchemist who shorts gold stocks (or even the metal itself), makes the announcement, and cleans up at the bottom AND the upswing. Machiavellian, but possible.

  106. kia January 2, 2007 9:13 pm


    Thanks, my problem is that all the reports lead back to the same reporter, Christopher Story.

    My question for you geniuses is, who else has a piece of this story?

    Questions, questions, questions in the mind of the concerned young person today…

  107. PB45 January 2, 2007 10:21 pm

    I sent many webs that never mentioned Chris Story. True Chris Story and the Artic BEACON have championed his plight there are literally hundreds more. For example: within there are at least 20 other webs that refer to Wanta dealings for President Regan.
    Wanta sold billions of rubles to desablize Russia, bought 2000tons gold for clandestine ops, first bought 90,000,000 barrels of oil outside the oil sphere of influence and then destabilized the OPEC monopoly. He was a primo right hand man to Regan.
    I am not political man at all as they are all the same in my book!, but the Chinese ask to deal with only Ambassador Wanta as he is a man of his word . They trust Wanta implicitly and believe in him after 20 yrs. successful dealings.
    Conversely, they spit on Paulson, Greenspan, Bush and Bearnake especially after that engineered heckling incident in Washington of vice chairman of China on an official visit. There was no official gala dinner just a quickie lunch and good bye. Heads of State do not act crudely only in the Bush White House it seems.When Want’s lawyer called on behalf of Wanta to find out when the treasury will release the $4.5 trillion, Paulson replied “when I am good and ready if I am ever ready”
    For the chinese it’s in the book and cannot be erased. Saving face is paramount in most Asian cultures. My friends in HK relayed to me that one event will alter US/China relations for 100yrs.God help us when they are on top.
    Read this web there are even original dated bonds, bills and certificates in the billions Wanta has signed. The CIA disinfomation reduced him to a jailed taxevader and incarcerated in a Swiss jail around the time Vince Foster met his maker(I wonder how?).
    Wanta sent a crpytic letter to Hillary Clinton concerning some of Bill Clinton’s short bills and rollovers and also mentioned a 250 mil. donation to Hillary’s private Children’s charity.
    Wanta was released a few months later! No questions, no terms just released.
    Say what you want, but please read the data first Kia. The web is below. My post #101 details many other writers, investigators and patriots.I have devoted months (in hours time) in study of this traversty./Peter

  108. Dr Jane Karlsson January 3, 2007 5:37 am

    Jeff Kassel, are you there? Very interested to read your #10. What did John Sununu say?

    Obviously you are right about the Chinese needing to go on lending to the US, recycling the dollars which US consumers paid for Chinese goods.

    But is this a stable situation? Doesn’t there come a point at which US consumers cannot continue borrowing to finance their consumption of Chinese goods?

  109. michael pento January 3, 2007 6:56 am

    Great commentary but one with a mistatement. The author claims that “the fed does not print money it must loan it into existence.” This is a specious claim. The fed can and does routinely purchase debt from the treasury-which directly injects money into the system. Therefore the fed has four ways to destroy the monetary base. Artifically low rates, ureasonably low reserve requirments, excessive repo activity and the direct purchase of the governments debt.

  110. kia January 3, 2007 10:04 am


    Thanks for the link, which thread is your post 101 contained in? I can’t seem to find it.


  111. kia January 3, 2007 12:30 pm

    PB45/Peter, Mikec44, Roy Berger,

    Thanks for the links, I’ve read all this info have been following this story for some time without the ability to make any firm conclusions (I have a similar problem with 911.) I have corresponded with Christopher and he stands staunchly by his story.

    If Paulsen was indicted in Germany, then it appears that this is coming to a head. The numbers of 4.5 Trillion, 370 Trillion and 1140 boggle the mind. From what I can see that much of the underpinning of the international banking community is being strained by this non-payment, and seriously undermines the ability of the FED to manage the circumstances.

    Since the three of you seem well versed on this issue, do you have any intuition on the situaton? It appears that this is the mother of all financial scandals.

    Thanks for sharing

  112. PB45 January 3, 2007 6:58 pm

    Hello Kia,
    The webs I posted on #101 are varied in information. One reason for so much text is the 17yrs elaspsed since AmeriTrust was formed. Remember Mr. Wanta’s primary mission was fomenting trouble for the USSR and cause it’s downfall. Remember Reagan’s “Evil Empire” preoccupation was a natioansl priority.
    There were the years Wanta was involved with Iran contra and weapons swapping. He was I believe Uraguyan (?) ambassador.
    The saga for his survival continued into the Clinton years.
    He was incarcerated in a Swiss jail on Clinton’s approval. At this point Clinton had Mark Rich and Vince Foster as bag men for his illicit income (a whole different story).
    After a veiled threat to Hillary Clinto he was realeased by the Swiss.
    Deemed expendable he was then cited by Wisconcin on tax evasion. Actually he paid on 3 separate occasions the bogus $14,000+ phony obligation. For this he was sentenced to 15 years in jail in Wisconscin for such a lowly offense.

    He was eventally freed and actually declared dead by the CIA.His sentence served he was released in 2003 or 2004(?). The CIA operatives actually had Wanta fall off their radar screen and verifed him dead.
    his was fortunate as if they knew his intentions he would probably received the same dose of drug mimicking Altsheimers as Ronald Regan certainly did.

    Now to the point of your query. No one can predict of course the unfolding of events.
    To me this is incrediblely and potentially defationary. Paulson and Bush Sr. attempted a derivatives raid Thangiving Day. In effect they hope for a collapse that would cover up the vast paper trail they have created.I have communicated with Chris Laird and he seems to agree with is assessment as well.
    However, there are som optimistic writers that are hoping that the return of the Wanta funds will free up money to support SSS’s future and re-up the deficits thru legitimate Treasury taxation. This could be a boon to the US citizen and future payments would reduce the national deficit and thereby release our children’s monetary obligation to it.
    I however have no faith in the latter. First the are degenerate people, numbered accounts and even secret hideaways in Paraguay are secured by Bush, Sr. The area is adjacent to an existing a/f US base and is also near the o largest aquifer in SA.
    Kia, I actually believe the system would be better to be purged and hopefully responsible leaders will emerge. Newt Gingrich has already said that Freedom of Speech must be modified to fit the internet. The very life of the Internet appears threatened. Another alarming event has been the demonizing of the NRA. While you ma ot agree with them they do wish to uphold the Americans rights to bear arms. Govts only fear power and this power while not largely a concentrated force is dispersed enough to cause plenty political heartburn for our honorable leaders, LOL.
    Democrats reverse the Bush revision in our Founder’s CONSTITUTION./Peter

  113. PB45 January 3, 2007 7:10 pm

    To my fellow posters
    I live in Asia and the internet is unrealiable and erratic at best.
    I have written 2 very concise and precise posts that were erased. My last effort was done strictly memory and may have some wrong dates or small mistakes. I apologize for that.
    Frankly, my physical condition and one handed typing ability don not allow me the strength for anymore today. I will attempt am more thorough synopsis and website guide soon. Long Live Constitution- it seoarates us from the barbarians!!

  114. khill January 4, 2007 12:50 am

    This Wanta nonsense is a freaking internet mind virus!Protect your brains and don’t get sucked in.The story stinks of propaganda from some nutty fringe group and the numbers are INSANE.Compare the “Wanta $27 trillion” to the GDP of Japan,China’s cash reserves or the market cap of the DOW.Helloooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!Ding dong!Wake up from sleep sleep.Please don’t be like Bush who dreamt his way into war with Iraq because he had no grasp of the facts about the real world.Conspiracy theory has become an industry and an alternative belief system.I guess people who need a magical world view but don’t want to believe in a god are drawn to big conspiracy stories.It seems an arbitrary world where there is no ultimate control is too frightening for many.Superstition,denial and fantasy are driving us into the mess many of us see coming.Living in the real world isn’t easy.When you seek truth you better be prepared for a life of pain.People want to believe there is a cash hoard out there waiting to save the U.S. economy.They want to believe there is a new energy source waiting to be unleashed when the energy crunch comes.People want to believe “the powers that be” have a plan that will fix the mess they created.Life isn’t that neat.DOW 12,600 going to be the top?Mr. Bear is getting hungry…….

  115. Dr Jane Karlsson January 4, 2007 4:24 am

    khill #114: ‘people want to believe “the powers that be” have a plan that will fix the mess they created.’

    But they DO have a plan. They are planning to attack Iran, to fix the mess they created in Iraq. And all the other messes too.

    Last night British Channel 4 News interviewed Richard Haass, President of the Council on Foreign Relations, and he said he thinks Israel will attack Iran. He also said Bush is not listening to the Baker report. The interviewer said ‘this week is key’, and Haass did not disagree. This week, all the naval hardware will be in place.

    The REALLY big problem, you see, is that Bush and Blair don’t get the respect they deserve. Attacking Iran will fix that. For God’s sake, people actually think they have some scruples! Scruples are for wimps.

  116. buddy January 4, 2007 4:48 am

    If Iran is attacked, it will throw the U.S. into a recession head first. This is why I believe Bush won’t actually attack. Not this year anyway. After yesterday, it sure felt like a header to the deflationary side or was it just a squeeze? I have to say, it scared me out of my liquid oil and silver positions in the morning as I paused to give more creedence to the deflationists argument. If everything goes along the current road, it looks like deflation could be possible, at least, more plausible than last year. If we get into it with Iran, the doubling or more of crude oil prices will throw us and possibly the rest of the world, into an inflation or hyper-inflation mode. Either way, stability loses and we are screwed. At the first sign of arctic temps invading the northeast or a standoff with Iran in the gulf, I will jump back into an oil position but till then, looks like it is coming down too much to stick it out in any position. Any thoughts from you wise old investors out there?

  117. Darren January 4, 2007 4:52 am

    Most investors lose money when playing the market by being on the wrong side. There are more looking for inflation to continue for they are predicting the future based on recent past of only the current trend & those that are prepared for deflation will become richer. Inflation will not make thr majority richer by making it easier to pay of debt & punish the few wise with cash& or have sold the world i.e., by shorting stocks, gold,oil.

  118. muleskinner January 4, 2007 7:14 am

    OPEC members will increase production to 45.3 million barrels per day in 2030 from 30.7 million barrels per day in 2003, the EIA report said, while non-OPEC countries will produce 72.6 million barrels per day in 2030 versus 48.9 million barrels per day in 2003.

    If oil supplies are that strong, oil is a go for the future.

    Demand must be down if the price is falling below sixty dollars.

    If you don’t drive as much, you can have an effect on the price. If you don’t drive at all, you can crush the demand for gasoline and the effect will ripple.

    BTW, if there is so much oil on the planet, what’s all of the fuzz and bother about all of this invading Iraq baloney, huffin and puffin about weapons, Saddam, freedom for Iraqis blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah?

    Enough already

  119. Makia January 4, 2007 7:30 am

    I love this site

  120. skeptical January 4, 2007 7:52 am

    Muleskinner “OPEC members will increase production to 45.3 million barrels per day in 2030 from 30.7 million barrels per day in 2003, the EIA report said, while non-OPEC countries will produce 72.6 million barrels per day in 2030 versus 48.9 million barrels per day in 2003.

    If oil supplies are that strong, oil is a go for the future.”

    This peak oil garbadge was used (propoganda) to pump up the oil price to line the pockets of bushy/chenny and their own portfolios (and their friends). Fossile fuels are constantly being created within the earths crust/mantal. We may eventually run out but not for a thousand years.

    Muleskinner “BTW, if there is so much oil on the planet, what’s all of the fuzz and bother about all of this invading Iraq baloney, huffin and puffin about weapons, Saddam, freedom for Iraqis blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah?”

    Because by controlling IRAQ oil we were able to KEEP it off the market (what is IRAQ export/production? Right).
    Also it was so the US could become PART of OPEC (IRAQ is an OPEC member). US is either directly part (before installing the puppet IRAQ government) or indirectly (after installing our puppets). Also it was just to do exactly what they did - create new and PERMANENT military bases in IRAQ as Saudi was becoming more adament that we get out of their country (which we did as soon as we went into IRAQ). We had to instill a new “democracy” (what a laugh get “democracy” at the end of a gun whether you want it or not). Finally we had to teach all those who wanted to “exit” trading dollars for oil a “lesson”

    Enough already “

  121. khill January 4, 2007 9:33 am

    “Israel feels that they are going to have to act alone and act fast.”"It now appears that the chances of Israel attacking Iran are over 75%. If this attack does transpire the world is going to be in for a massive oil shock and the fragile US market that is trying to deal with the collapse of the housing sector will truly tumble. Energy stocks, alternative Energy stocks, uranium stocks and almost the entire commodities sector will experience a big move up. This move up will not all take place at the same time; some sectors might actually fall with the markets while other sectors in the commodity markets rise.”…”
    We think the Israeli government and militarily are increasingly feeling that their only option is to attack as soon as possible. This attack will not be easy in fact if it occurs it will get downright ugly and the energy markets will go ballistic. As it is things are already bad enough and if Israel attacks Iran its almost impossible to tell how bad things could get; without a doubt the situation will get extremely explosive and the whole region will be thrown into state of massive turmoil.”…”If attacked Iran could completely shut down the Straits of Hormuz where over 25% of the world’s and over 80% of the Persian Gulf oil passes through. Imagine the effect of temporarily removing 13-15 million barrels of oil per day from the markets. Oil will easily be trading past 99 dollars maybe even past 120 dollars and Gold could easily explode past 720. Even without a war with Iran the geopolitical situation is bad enough in the region; Iraq could descend into a full scale massive civil war that eventually starts to draw its neighbours in. We already believe Iraq is in the midst of a civil war…”

  122. khill January 4, 2007 9:42 am

    Got Gold?Got QID?Oh my……….

  123. kia January 4, 2007 9:51 am

    PB45 (#113) FWIIW I compose posts using a email program that has a spell checker, and then copy the files to this site.

    Where are you in S.E. Asia?

  124. khill January 4, 2007 10:30 am

    Re Peak OIL:Consider the following facts:

    Global oil discoveries peaked in 1964.
    Since 1981, the world has consumed more oil than it has discovered. Today, we consume roughly 4 barrels of oil for every 1 barrel that is discovered.
    Saudi Arabia, which is often pointed to as the “go-to country” for increased production when supplies get tight, has been unable to increase production in the last two years.
    Matt Simmons, an industry analyst, examined over 200 technical papers on oil fields in the Middle East—which everyone believes has most of the world’s remaining oil—and concluded that oil reserves there are significantly overstated and that production from Saudi Arabia itself may be close to peaking.
    Compounding the Peak Oil issue, global natural gas supplies are predicted to peak around 2020 (though it may happen much sooner). Natural gas in North America peaked in 2001.
    http://www.grinningplanet.com/2006/05-16/peak-oil-faq.htm http://www.oilposter.org/posterlarge.html “Of the 65 largest oil producing countries in the world, up to 54 have past their peak of production and are now in decline, including the USA (in 1970/71) and the North Sea (in 2001)”"ASPO’s latest model suggests that ‘regular’ oil peaked in 2004. If heavy oil, deepwater, polar and natural gas liquids are considered, the oil peak is projected for around 2010. Combined oil and gas, as shown above, are expected to also peak around 2010. Other researchers such as Kenneth Deffeyes and A. M. Samsam Bakhtiari have produced models with similar or even earlier projected dates for oil peak.”"A risk mitigation study on Peak Oil was released in early 2005, commissioned by the US Department of Energy. Prepared by the Science Applications International Corporation (SAIC), and titled “Peaking of World Oil Production: Impacts, Mitigation and Risk Management” [PDF], it is known commonly as the Hirsch Report after its primary author Robert L. Hirsch. The executive summary of the report warns that “as peaking is approached, liquid fuel prices and price volatility will increase dramatically, and, without timely mitigation, the economic, social, and political costs will be unprecedented. Viable mitigation options exist on both the supply and demand sides, but to have substantial impact, they must be initiated more than a decade in advance of peaking.” [Emphasis added.] Unfortunately nothing like the kind of efforts envisaged have yet begun.” http://www.energybulletin.net/primer.php “It is now widely acknowledged by the world’s leading petroleum geologists that more than 95 percent of all recoverable oil has now been found.”"According to industry consultants IHS Energy, 90% of all known reserves are now in production, suggesting that few major discoveries remain to be made. There have been no significant discoveries of new oil since 2002. In 2001 there were 8 large scale discoveries, and in 2002 there were 3 such discoveries. In 2003 there were no large scale discoveries of oil. Given geologists’ sophisticated understanding of the characteristics that would indicate a major oil find, is is highly unlikely that any area large enough to be significant has eluded attention and no amount or kind of technology will alter that.”"Oil is now being consumed four times faster than it is being discovered, and the situation is becoming critical”"Saudi Arabia is a major oil producer with 73% of all incremental world demand being met by this country. The worrying fact is that 90% of their production comes from only 5 mega fields (one is the Ghawar field which is the biggest ever discovered), and are all at risk of unplanned production collapse. In 2004 there were warning signs of production falling into depletion. For years, Aramco, the Saudi national company, have injected enormous amounts of seawater (7 million barrels daily) into their biggest field to boost production. These methods have only temporary effects, and lead to accelerated rates of depletion in the future.”" While many scientists have not reached agreement about the exact date that world oil production will peak, the degree of consensus among them is quite remarkable. Most agree that the Peak will happen sometime before 2010, suggesting that the world may be facing shortfalls much sooner than expected.”" Senior Saudi energy officials have privately warned US and European counterparts that Opec would have an “extremely difficult time” meeting demand. Saudi Arabia calculates there is a 4.5m b/d gap between what the world needs and what the kingdom can provide. Repeated promises for increases in production have consistently failed to materialize.”
    Senior Saudi energy officials have privately warned US and European counterparts that Opec would have an “extremely difficult time” meeting demand. Saudi Arabia calculates there is a 4.5m b/d gap between what the world needs and what the kingdom can provide. Repeated promises for increases in production have consistently failed to materialize.” http://www.oildecline.com/ “Of the eleven members of OPEC, several have already reached their peak—Indonesia, Iran, Kuwait, Nigeria, Iraq, and Venezuela. As mentioned earlier global oil discoveries replaced only half of the oil produced last year. We stopped replacing the oil we consume each year in 1985. We have been running energy deficits since then.” http://www.financialsense.com/stormwatch/2005/1014.html “Only three major fields have been discovered since 1969. There have been no major fields or “elephants” as they are called in the industry since 1976. Simmons’ study found that since 1980, only three fields out of all of the new discoveries are producing over 200,000 barrels a day. In the 1990’s, over 420 fields were discovered, but only 11 have production that exceeds 100,000 barrels per day.”"The point to understand is that we are depleting our oil reserves at an annual rate of 6% a year; while demand growth is growing at an annual rate of 2%. In order to simply keep even, the world’s oil industry would have to find the equivalent of 8% a year of new oil reserves from new discoveries. This is not happening.” http://www.financialsense.com/series3/part1.htm

  125. zephyr January 4, 2007 10:49 am

    Skeptical, some of what you say is very interesting. However, I still have a hard time with the oil replenishing itself from within theory. Who out there has some solid evidence that this is possible. Otherwise, I believe that theory falls in the realm of make believe.

    Khill, wasn’t the straits of Hormuz prophecied by someone as a hot spot in the future? And as far as Israel goes, they will get theirs someday. Like when the Red Sox finally beat the Yankees, payback is a bitch! And how long do you think China and Russia will sit back and watch? Really? Look at a globe. This is their backyard. Reverse the situation and pretend Russia were in Mexico and threatening Canada? C’mon people!

    Khill, what you say about some people believing in farfetched conspiracy theories, but imagining there being a God, well now we’ve gone too far! I like that! I know I’ve put some crazy scenarios out there but I think I rationalize them pretty well. Judge Judy school of thought….if it doesn’t make sense, it probably isn’t true.

  126. kia January 4, 2007 10:55 am


    What is your take on all the naval hardware in/near the Strait of Hormuz?

    Smell anything like the Gulf of Tonkin?

  127. buddy January 4, 2007 10:56 am

    Crude doesn’t seem to paying any attention to the peak oil argument for the past year, just geo political drivers and seasonal requirements. It seems, for those who subscribe to conspiracy theories, that commodities are getting conveiniently hammered down for the final blow with the dawn of the new year. They were hammered once last year and now the job is being finished. Bush won’t attack Iran unless Iran attacks, in an overt way, a U.S. interest. He can’t get away with it this time. he had mainly inside support and false outside support for Iraq, the only public support he has this time is from Cheny. If he were to attack Iran under these circumstances, he would be investigated, impeached and tried. Congress will never authorize any funding for such an adventure. If Israel attacks Iran, we may let Israel dangle in the wind, secretly wanting to get rid of this national responsibility that hog ties the U.S around every corner.

  128. kia January 4, 2007 11:18 am


    What khill isn’t explaining is the time frame difference between the creation of fossil fuels and our capability to deplete it. The net result is that we have extracted “roughly” 50% of the oil in 150 years which took most of the Carboniferous to create. The first half is the low hanging fruit, the second half will be characterized by the deep drilling efforts in the Gulf of Mexico. Unfortunately given rising global demand these new discoveries will have trouble even providing “replacement” oil.

    Our conundrum is can be likened to sitting in a room full pistachios, with two rules 1) we must eat them in the room 2) we must leave the shells in the room. As our appetite devours the pistachios, we have to spend more time and energy looking through the spent shells to find more to eat. Introducing competitors (China, India) into the room means we have to look faster.

    An examination of the US oil industry reveals no major “finds” since the north slope of Alaska. Chevron was paid in the 70’s by the US gov’t to look for oil in ANWAR, and they gave up because of a lack of encouraging data. Since then the growth of the “estimated/proven reserves” have resulted from “remodeling” of existing data, which coincided with the desire by oil executives to boost their stock prices. This virtuous circle was broken when Royal Dutch Shell had to revise their estimates not once, but twice.

    Our best strategy is to diversify away from fossil fuels which means nuclear for baseload, and solar/wind/tidal/geothermal for regional/temporal supplementation where appropriate. Climate Change will hopefully encourage our diversification as it’s costs become more apparent every day. Diversification will also reduce our chronic need to separate foreigners from their own resources.


  129. zephyr January 4, 2007 11:22 am

    Sorry Buddy, that’s all very wishful thinking. The only way Iran attacks first is if it’s another false flag operation. He doesn’t need support. Investigated, Impeached and Tried? You’se be smokin’ some fine weed! On what planet? The Dems have already demonstrated no balls/no spine platform. They’re in, to hell with their constituents.

    I get the feeling that even the well-intentioned get led into a room upon election, and are told the real world governing scenario and not to fuck with it, lest they end up conveniently dead. Congress? As Makia might say…BaaHaaHaHaHa..HooHooHeeHeee!

    Lastly, much as I would love to see it, what in the last 50 years leads you to believe we’ll abandon Israel? They won’t let us….they lead us around by the nose. I envision few scenarios where we leave Israel, none of them good for us.

    Sorry Buddy, that world only exists in some parallel universe.

  130. peter ludyjan January 4, 2007 11:23 am

    The banks don’t hold the paper. Most are are pass thru notes, held by forein insurance companys. What are they going to due with all these propertys ?

  131. zephyr January 4, 2007 11:24 am


  132. Makia January 4, 2007 11:59 am

    MMMmmmmmmmm. . . Guiness. . .. mmmmmmmm

  133. Makia January 4, 2007 12:04 pm

    Oh, sorry, didn’t realize i was interupting an actual conversation.

  134. Makia January 4, 2007 12:41 pm

    Judge Judy school of thought!


  135. skeptical January 4, 2007 1:18 pm

    “kia Says:


    What khill isn’t explaining is the time frame difference between the creation of fossil fuels and our capability to deplete it. The net result is that we have extracted “roughly” 50% of the oil in 150 years which took most of the Carboniferous to create. ”

    Wow now KIA can you tell me where the SCIENTIC evidence is that shows that the oil being pumped out of the ground came from fossiles that died in the Carboniferous age? I dont mean some elementary school science book, I mean real scientific evidence? No there is none, it like so many other THEORIES holds our attention away from the truth.

  136. Makia January 4, 2007 1:22 pm

    TRUTH? Oil doesn’t come from fossils? Then why do we call it fossil fuel????


  137. Makia January 4, 2007 1:23 pm

    . . . .

  138. Makia January 4, 2007 1:23 pm

    I crack myself up.

  139. skeptical January 4, 2007 1:59 pm

    “Makia Says:

    TRUTH? Oil doesn’t come from fossils? Then why do we call it fossil fuel????


    Because EVERYBODY KNOWS that it comes from fossiles. No kidding aside, that is the common “theory” a 100 years ago that has been allow to persist.

  140. zephyr January 4, 2007 2:42 pm

    Well, then help us out Skeptical, or at least help me out. What makes your theory more plausable? I’m serious….wouldn’t be the first time we’ve been sold a bill of goods and then had the lie perpetuated.

    Are you saying it keeps renewing from the center of the earth? If so, maybe that’s why oil seems to be the source of so much evil. Cuz if it’s coming from the center of the earth, then Satan surely must be making it in his Hell Brewing Company and sending it on up. That’s why there are so many varieties of oil, including light sweet crude for those more weight conscience….. ;-)

    I know, I’m a jackass.

  141. kia January 4, 2007 3:50 pm


    The field of study that you would want look at is called igneous petrology ;-)

  142. larry January 4, 2007 4:13 pm

    just like the script….gold up and dollar down…. equity markets in melt down….ok,,,,give it a few more days

  143. kia January 4, 2007 4:14 pm

    Check out the latest from the IMF scroll down for Key IMF Financial Statistics for Dec 28, 2006

    Credit outstanding has gone from 55.4 billion at the end of 2004 to just 10.1 billion at the end of 2006. It’s important to note that banks work inversely from a business. Loans are assets for a bank and a liability for a business. This is a decline of 82% in assets that the IMF was holding just two years ago. At the end of 1998 the IMF had created 60.5 billion in loans, so since the end of 1998 assets have gone down 83.3%.

    I know both Bolivia and Ecuador are talking about paying off their IMF debts fairly soon. The largest holder of IMF debt is currently Turkey. Nobody is borrowing from the IMF and why should they, China and Russia are lending at much more favorable terms. Where does this all lead?

    The IMF financed itself back in the 1940’s with gold, what happens to this asset if the IMF is no longer a lender? As of August 2006 the IMF claimed that they held 103.4 million ounces (3,217 metric tons) of gold at designated depositories. Certainly the IMF has some level of fixed costs that must be met to finance buildings, payroll and their excessive meddling in the economies of the world, what does one consider this level of expense to be and how possibly can 10.1 billion in loans be enough to pay for this expense?

    If you’re a holder of gold, I think I’d be a bit concerned about some level of IMF sells of gold entering the market, especially at these prices.

  144. silver dude January 4, 2007 7:00 pm

    I am Leo Wanta and you all our crazy, that I know for sure!!!

  145. zephyr January 4, 2007 7:29 pm

    Silver dude, any relation to the Silver Surfer? Just curious….I’m Mr. Fantastic and I’m rubbery.

  146. Rich January 4, 2007 7:40 pm

    Hey kia.

    Nice posts, thanks.

    On IMF gold, those 103 million ounces owned by the IMF and it’s members, are worth around $64,066,000,000 at today’s price ($622). The US owns about 23% of those gold reserves and I believe Congress would have to approve the sale of any significant amount of gold reserves by the IMF.

    Presumably the IMF’s infrastructure has diminished in line with it’s portfolio, so I’m not sure if selling off gold reserves is necessary in order to make ends meet - these guys are bankers so I’m sure they know how to cover costs and then some!?

    However, that IS a lot of gold! It is a proverbial $64 Billion Dollar Question!?

    I’m not sure anyone knows how much gold has been mined in the world to date, but some estimates put it at 10 Billion ounces, that would be worth $6,220,000,000,000 (or $6.2 Trillion) - about 50% of US Annual GDP.

    With around $400 Trillion in derivatives out there it really puts in to perspective just how little gold there really is.

    Having said that, if the IMF dumped gold the price would be hit pretty hard in the short term.

    Cheers Rich

    PS. I think gold is made from dead humans, compressed over millenia at the worlds core, leprechauns then take the raw material and make the gold bars that we find in banks today (hey! It’s just a theory OK!?)



  147. Darren January 4, 2007 8:05 pm

    Karl & all

    Regarding post 100, It is dangerous to think that war will pull a country out of depresion. Which was taught when I was in school & I think most think is true.

    Understanding of what one is thinking is important & when individuals lifes are @ stake it is even more important.

    Emotions not only causes when one will buy & sell stocks
    Emotions are the reason we are @ piece or @ war. Emotions are products of your premises the thinking you have done or failed to do. If you thinking is based on invalid theories you will sow what you hate i.e., have the president go to war because he thinks it will pull the economy out of depresion.

  148. PB45 January 5, 2007 2:09 am

    Hello posters,
    Kia just to clear up a common misconception about the IMF. In and of itself the IMF owns no gold at all. The individual members deposited various amounts of gold depending their world status. The US is the single largest contributor. In those days Europe individual nationstates joined UK, France, germany et al.
    In return the IMF invented and distributed SDR’s (Special Drwing Rights). A scam really to make people think gold was still used by govt.
    The scheme was actually meant to placate the world towards the UDS$ that had just closed it’s international settlements in gold.This is how the Fed and the US govt gained reserve currency status.
    SDR’s have no real value by themselves only contain the option to be redeemed by member nations of their gold.
    The IMF cannot sell any gold by itself as it is not theirs. The member nation probably with Congressional or Parliamentary vote could.
    The nonsensical banter by politicians is just that. The same applies to the German govt selling it’s gold. Again the Bundesbank has the final say and not the politicians (thank God!). Central Banks actually want to buy gold, but little bullion is available. North Korea in their infinite wisdom from KIM has just sold 50billion in bullion which some European entity snapped up in one tasty morsel.
    Why they did not off China first dibs is unfathomable to me as the Chinese want to raise their reserves.
    Poster #114 Khill
    I am sure you have not given the subject of Ambassador much study or thought.Recently politcians (Senator Grassey for one)) have said in essence what you have said. He should not be paid because that is too money for one individual to control.
    The Global Analyst and it sister company world reports are a highly esteemed British think tank and advisory service. It is expensive and is mainly distributed to heads of governments and large corporate entities.
    The settlement made in Virginia in June 06 is on record awarding the $4.5trillion from the Treasury & Fed.
    Chris Story has named names in govt, nation states that have claims and a list of banks that participated in the fraud coverup. Do you think NOT one of these accused would have sued, or publicly denied any knowedge. No they have chosen to just ignore and stonewall AmeriTrust.
    I was going to reconstruct a very long and detailed email I wrote twice which was wiped off because of internet interuptions. That email contained actual scans of contracts and certificates for a multitude of transactions in Rubles, gold bullion and spot oil deliveries. There included actual corresponance from R.Reagan,B. Clinton and scads of other govts, corporations and banks.
    From the reaction from this board (with a few exceptions) about Mr. Wanta is typical of the span of attention of a high schooler. Illuminating and teaching the posters is not enough incentive for me as I already see what the reactions will.
    Poster Dr. Jane here is a thought to consider.
    Instead I think the blog should concentrate on 3 events today. The first is the removal of the two top generals in Iraq, the second is the resigination and reassignement of Negroponte of Homeland Security (what a momumental Oxymoron that is, LOL) to Dept of Defense (assigned to Conolessa Rice). Third is the resignation of chief of Nuclear commision( fissionable materials, warheads and reactors fuel warden). Now assume Bush’s generals think more troops or attaching Iran a huge miskake. Also he would need a knowledgeable patsy to help Rice who spins like a top now visiting nations to find out their reactions. Or maybe they will cook up a story (as usual) about a clandestine mole group of Iranians that will trigger a dirt bomb on US soil. Who better than Homeland Security chief to handle the BS. Factor in a nuclear chief that refuses to allow transfer of nuclear warheads, bombs or canon ordinance thru populated cities or waterways.
    Poster Darren #145 this war deception and misdirection of the public dates back to Rome & Macedonia.
    Considering above and add in the largest US Naval Armada ever floated stationed near Iran and Arabian Gulf.
    Given Bush’s previous bullheaded approach to the Middle East, his falsification of WMDs and misreporting of Iraqi evens, the resignation of numerous generals (Colin Powell, Tommy Franks)that vehemently disagreed of Iraqi invasion, total his disregard for human Iraqi civilian lives and his mad obsession of backing Israel (must be his Southern Texan natural affection of all Jewish people, LOL).
    Than dont be surprised if the following occurs.
    a) Bush condones an Israeli raid on Iran’s projects (maybe even using limted nuclear bunkerbusters, hence all the US naval muscle)Read Victor Corpus “Assassins Mace” and see what would happen to US naval forces. I can’t get the web now but very excellent portrayal of weapons and response strategies.
    b) A senseless & insane limited US assualt on Iranian missile, naval and troop concentrations pre-empting retaliation of mining Acquba’s oil transport.
    c) Our own full scale attacks on Iranian nuclear facilities and a joint Syrian or Lebanon invasion/s by Israeli forces.
    Had you studied the events leading up to June’s Ambassador Wanta settlement then you would clearly see the necessity of a grand diversion of war to cover criminal politics in Washington and even Europe (Blair just landed in Florida with all the family in tow, seems the rats are jumping ship BTW, anybody see or hear Cheney or Paulson since the Ford funeral?
    I would like remind the posters if they were too young to remember Bush has eulogized and immortalized exPres Ford.
    The facts will bear me out that Ford had no respect at all sfter the pardon Nixon. he was also considered to have a lack of intelligence (as is Bush) even to the point LBJ was quoted as saying “Ford could not walk & chew gum at the same time”!http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/mlasalle/index?blogid=38
    The sudden non discussion of about anything “axis of evil” member NOKOR is a dead giveaway other Arab and Muslim countries are stocking up nuclear missiles, warheaheads and materiale.
    Why their sudden interest? Simple! the Muslims sects have been slaughtering each other for decades. Saudi, Egypt, Algeria and the rest trusted Israel more with having nuclear weapons than their own brother Muslims. They could have bought from Pakistan with oil revenues a decade ago.
    Thanks Mike for the opportunity to post here and your kind words./Peter

  149. Dr Jane Karlsson January 5, 2007 5:13 am

    PB45/Peter, many thanks for all the interesting info. Did you say in one post, I can’t now find it, that Wanta’s 2000 tonnes of gold were ‘for clandestine purposes’? Do you know anything about the clandestine purposes?

    skeptical #120 and #135: I had a long discussion on an earlier thread with Ronandreas about oil, and we agreed that oil is most likely abiotic as the Russians have always said. But the idea that it’s constantly created deep down turned up problems, namely what is the carbon source down there?

    My favourite idea about oil is that most or all of the hydrocarbons on the planet have been there since the beginning. Short-chain ones (eg methane) and long-chain ones (oil) are constantly being converted one to another, methane to oil under conditions of very high pressure, and extremely slowly, and oil to methane by bacteria. This is roughly what the Russians think, if I have understood them correctly. What do you think?

  150. Dr Jane Karlsson January 5, 2007 6:30 am

    Just found something scary. Please comment, everybody:


  151. Makia January 5, 2007 6:31 am

    PB45, thanks for your thoughts and observations. Don’t take it the wrong way, though, when i say it might not be appropriate to criticize our attention spans. I don’t think it is a stretch to say that all of the regular posters here are “lifetime learners,” but i also know that we are generally busy people and have more going on in our lives that theBull. No one here will criticize you in a disrespectful way for your thoughtful and informative comments, which they seem to be though i haven’t had the time to read much here recently. But knocking folk’s attention spans smacks of pretentiousness and a lack of “benefit of the doubt” that is part of this little culture Michael has fathered. Just a suggestion. That being said, be yourself. We all add what we add. Recently, i’ve focused on sprinkling in some levity. It has fit in with my mood and my schedule, and no one’s told me to stop acting a fool (yet). I give you the benefit of the doubt; you’ve added a lot recently and its appreciated, but it never turns out well to be full of yourself (or to not take yourself with a grain of salt sometimes), even if you do know a lot.

  152. Rich January 5, 2007 6:39 am

    Hey Peter.

    I jumped in to the Wanta story for a day and spent a lot of time doing my own searching. The problem was there was so much BS info out there, the numbers are huge and some of the stories are written by folks with a middle school education, which serves to seriously diminish the creedence of the claims.

    I think my last comment on this was that outrageously large claims/theories require commensurate amounts of proof/evidence, and so far I haven’t seen it.

    In the past I owned a company that had a decent board of directors, one of them was a former Undersecretary of Commerce who had become embroiled in the BCCI scam - - which is probably the most notorious banking/financial scam (involving the worlds elite) in the history of the world (excluding the Wanta claim). So I am more than willing to try and understand this issue, and very capable of believing it, however I’d need the proof you posted to move down that road.

    I do like your analysis of the current geo-political shennanigans, it’s as good an interpretation as I’ve seen out there. The one thing I thought when the Negroponte announcement was made was that perhaps Condi and Bush were fighting and that she’d follow Powell out the door and Negroponte would take over within a few months.

    Either way, the old adage is that you can’t mobilize the military without deploying them sooner or later, so these are scary times, I wouldn’t want to be some poor Iranian shepherd living in Abadan or Bandar Abbas around about now!

    Cheers Rich

  153. zephyr January 5, 2007 7:24 am

    Dr Jane 150, OH MY!! I simply do not understand what Bush, Blair, etc al are thinking. Actually, Dr. Jane, you live in Britain…tell me, do the Brits want to go this far? I would guess not. See my prior posts on Israel. They will be the death of us all. As I’ve said, maybe Mel Gibson had a point.

    At what point do you declare Bush and his posse criminally insane? Are they truly suicidel? Is it that damned fundamentalist self-fulfilling prophecy death wish? What gives??

    On the face of it, I’m glad these weapons exist because they bring balance to global power struggles. Balance has generally prevented war for fear of equivalent retaliation. A rational leader, knowing what the outcome of aggression would be, would be rational enough to know he should not provoke all out attack. But our leaders are fuckin’ nuts! They have to be. I repeat, it’s suicide!

    The scenario painted is bleak but very realistic. And I don’t blaim the rest of the world. First, we’re obviously the aggressors. Second, WE are in THEIR back yard. Of course they’re going to defend their turf!

    Man, any other thought? So much for yesterdays levity.

  154. Makia January 5, 2007 7:29 am

    I’m sorry guys, but i’m not scared at all. I love life, i love people, but life is fragile and we are generally a very stupid race. We have, as a race not just americans, ignored our environment and negleted our women. Call it ignorance, call it stupidity, call it ugly, call it nievety. There are innocents, but not that many. And innocents have been dying for a long long time. If it is my time to die, it is my time. It is my time to watch my family suffer, perhaps it is. I cannot escape fate. And though choice is far more powerful than fate, fate does exist. Should humans truly come to terms with what i am saying here, we won’t have to worry about war any more. But in my amateur opinion the likelyhood of that happening in the next 20 years, or even my lifetime is _extremely_ low. To that end, let the missles fly. Let the guns blaze. Let the soldiers and the civilians perish. If the ships are destroyed, then they can’t shoot anymore. If the soldier is killed, he can’t cause any more harm. Me? I’ll move myself and my family to the mountains or the feild should i be given the choice of fight or flight. We don’t stand a chance against those weapons, and we stand the best chance of survival should we not pose a threat. I’ll be here to help anyone who asks for it, and i will live in peace. Peace to you all, and please lighten your hearts and your minds. War over “there” is stupid, but you can ignore it and i am suggesting that you should, as it is stupid. War over “here” is life-threatening and you should survive however you can, as long as it is in peace. Shed your judgement, and your hate if you have it; for the most part we know not what we do. You may think that i am simple for suggesting this, but consider that i might just be extremely practical. Consider that this paradigm is the only thing that will free our race from the danger of ourselves.

    I am a practical person. I am not talking about paradise, i am not talking about foolproof immortality. I am talking about putting the probabilities in the favor of passing my genetic line and teaching my children and anyone else who is interested (and not that my children will be interested) how to be healthy and respect and use our internal and our external environments. At least consider what i am saying, perhaps it will mean something to you someday.

  155. zephyr January 5, 2007 8:12 am

    “All that is necessary for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing”- Edmund Burke

    Nice sentiment, Makia, and if it works for you, great. As for me, even if there is truly nothing I can do, I can’t just ignore it. That group think has permitted genocide over the years. It has allowed this group of hucksters to rise to power in this country, and whether I like it or not, they do represent me to some extent.

    In my mind, doing nothing in the face of such great evil may be a worse crime/sin that the initial act. I cannot have peace in my heart knowing what wrongs are being perpetrated “over there”.

    How you feel is cool with me because I have no place to judge anothers intentions. As for me, I can rest when I’m dead.

    “Freedom consists not in doing what we like, but in having the right to do what we ought.”- Pope John Paul II

  156. zephyr January 5, 2007 8:14 am

    And PB45, thank you for everything you have brought to the table.

  157. zephyr January 5, 2007 8:20 am

    On an economic note, someone must have dumped a ton of bullion onto the market. Gold has plummeted to almost $600. What’s up?

  158. Makia January 5, 2007 8:29 am

    Zeph, what are you going to do?

  159. Makia January 5, 2007 8:30 am

    And do you think I’m going to “do nothing?”

  160. Makia January 5, 2007 8:31 am

    Also, I’ve heard that John Paul II sold the gas to the Nazis that killed the Jews. Is that what he “ought” to do?

  161. bp January 5, 2007 8:55 am

    as much as I’ve seen posters bust on the government on this site I would be curious to hear how those here feel about this article - http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/010507J.shtml

    to me government is but a tool, much like a gun - depends on whose hands it is in - right now gov seems to be in the hands of the wealthy

  162. zephyr January 5, 2007 8:58 am

    158 Don’t know what I’m gonna do, that’s what’s still vexing me. That’s why I hike every day and pray. But I won’t rest.

    159 Never said “you” weren’t doing anything. My post merely implied your approach isn’t for me. Your situation is different, you have 1 young child and 1 imminent arrival. I’m stressing why I can’t take that aproach.

    160 Where the hell did that come from? Dude, first off, John Paul aka Karol Wajtyla grew up in Nazi occupied Poland and watched many of his young Jewish friends dragged away. He was a priest under Communist rule. He witnessed firsthand 2 tyrannical regimes. Maybe that’s why he hated war so much. I’m not sure what your point is there. And that’s a personal “shot”, not cool.

  163. kia January 5, 2007 9:06 am


    Thanks for the cogent posts. Rich can you reconcile Peter’s posts about the ownership of the gold? I’m especially interested given today’s spot price drop to $605, along with steep down drafts in bonds, stocks, oil and the CRB. Could be just a USD phenomena?

    And something is happening, but you don’t know what it is, Do you Mister Jones? I certainly don’t.

    Looks like they are busy re-arranging the deck chairs on the ghost ship USS Bush. Surge replaces escalation because it sounds nicer. Saddam is no longer available to carry out US policy to destablilize the Iranian government, something we have been after since 1954, so it is time for Bush to take off the gloves. Time to get rid of the generals who oppose the surge. Time to put off the eventual air lift out of the Green Zone for whoever is wins the presidency in 2008. One wonders what will prevent Saudi Arabia and Iran waging a proxy war in Iraq once the last helicopter leaves.

    It certainly smells like something, but probably not Peace.


  164. Makia January 5, 2007 9:32 am

    Zephyr, sorry for not checking my sources; but i read recently this about JP from a source i consider credible. On second thought, it may have been JP I, not II. This is a serious faux pas on my part and i do apologize. As far as what you are going to do, i wish you luck. I really do. Thing is that while we must have good intentions to underpin good actions, “the road to hell is paved with good intentions.” I will never “sit by” while inoocents perish before my eyes. But that’s before my eyes. What can i do about Iranians, or even Mexicans, or Isrealis when i’m in Pennsylvania?

    Dear Lord, grant me the power to make change for the better; the patience to deal with what i can’t change; and the wisdom to know the differece.

    I paraphrase, again, not checking my sources. But we are all familiar with this prayer.

    I have friends and family in Iraq. I don’t want them to die or to kill, but what should i do? Stop them? Vote? Vote with my dollars? I mean, what the fuck?

    I am not espousing that anyone should just “not do anything” about suffering; i am espousing that one should not kill oneself in pursuit of health. History is a big thing and we, like it or not, are only a small part of a story that extends (hopefully) in both directions. Do what you can, but sleep well at night. Die, or be killed, with honor.

    Yes, this is an extremely difficult and personal subject. We all have different opportunities. But what if people en masse stopped playing the game? What if the intelligent brought the required awareness to the public, instead of killing themselves trying to change the rules; or worse yet, thinking that there are rules that can be changed? This ridiculous global economy and government does not have rules! The only rule is the golden rule: He who has the gold, makes the rules. And the folks with the gold are getting us all to fight eachother in their competition. The geo-political awareness put forth in this thread is interesting, but we all know that we don’t know. We all know things are not going to change by our hand. I just want good people with good hearts to sleep well at night knowing that they are doing everything they can to help the people that they can.

    There is a saying in taiji, “an ounce defeats a thousand pounds,” this is with proper technique and understanding. There is another principal that applies: triangulation. A small change here translates into a major change down the road. There is another principal that applies, and i don’t have a name for it. But think about an enormous boat, how much effort is required to change its direction? A tiny amount of force on the opposite side of the rudder. The boat is our society and our cultures. You can’t push the front of the boat to the side to change its direction; but thats how most people think about it. But the boat is designed with a device the back of the boat where a relatively tiny amount of pressure can change the course of the whole vessel. What are you going to do? My suggestion is to find the rudders.

    As far as my comment about JPII goes, maybe i’m wrong, i’m going to check. But nothing surprises me anymore. People that are vilified on this site are heroes to millions. Greenspan, Reagan, FDR, etc, etc. And no, it was not a “personal shot.” It was a shot at JPII. Shame on me if i’m off-base or misinformed, but what are you gonna do? I’m not the enemy.

  165. kia January 5, 2007 9:52 am

    Jane (#150) we are witnessing the end of the usefulness of 20th century warfare, usurped by asymmetrical warfare. We’ve had the opportunity to learn this lesson since WWII and have chosen to ignore it. The price of our ignorance is being paid in Iraq. As the old slogan goes “If you think Education is Expensive, Try Ignorance.”

    bp (#160) thanks for a good article, my question for you is, can you identify a government not in the hands of the wealthy?


  166. Makia January 5, 2007 9:52 am

    There is another very important point i negleted to mention about an ounce defeating a thousand pounds, for those who are interested - and that is “timing.” Taking the long view is important, but being able to perceive the proper time for the proper action is just as powerful. This is the balance that needs to be pursued. And i can conceive that these two skills of patience and timing can have a tremendous impact on the entire society, or economy, or culture.

  167. Makia January 5, 2007 9:54 am

    . . . impact from a single individual.

    We all know of examples.

  168. Makia January 5, 2007 10:00 am
  169. zephyr January 5, 2007 10:20 am

    165 absolutely. A very difficult thing but true. Basically gaining patience and trying to discern God’s will.
    166 Also very true. I mentioned one. You called him a Nazi collaborator.

  170. zephyr January 5, 2007 10:55 am

    Makia, sorry I missed your call. We’re cool….it’s just debate. I think we both deeply want the same thing and recognize many of the same things. We just have some minor differences. You’re a good man, I can tell. One thing about the printed word that IS better….you can see more of a person’s soul in their gunuine heartfelt writings. That’s why I dig so many of you folks. You’re all REAL.

    I’ll be the first to say that the Catholic church has had some corrupt and immoral times over the centuries. That’s obvious….and shameful. And to be honest, I think more than 50% in the priesthood don’t have “goodness” in their hearts. I really don’t. I think celibacy is also very wrong to impose. It denies human touch and personal relations. I think that’s why so many turn bitter.

    That said, there also have been many very good to great people associated with the church. Most are anonymous people toiling in extreme conditions ala Mother Theresa. In the public eye, John Paul was an extraordinary man and the perfect “front man” for not just Catholicism but Christianity. Check out his biography, it’s an amazing read. Some of the stuff he did was very loving and courageous. Read about his first trip back to Poland after he became pope. Poland was still very much under Soviet control. Tensions were incredibly high upon his return. He walked right into the teeth of communism and fostered non-violent change from within, which was truly amazing for its time. Have you ever witnessed a global display of mourning for one person’s death? Any of you older folks? I know people in their 80’s who said they had never seen anything like that.

    That wouldn’t have happened if the man were a phony. For what it was worth, he collectively apologized for the church’s many sins over the years before his trip to Israel. It doesn’t change the past, especially the distant past, but it was a gesture which meant alot to many people.

    Did he make mistakes? Of course. I disagreed with many of his stances. But the soul of the man was good and for someone in his position, he used the office of the papacy very well in defending human rights. If people choose to dwell on his shortcomings, well, that’s their choice. Nothing he could have done would have altered their opinion, I believe. There have been many bad or indifferent popes over the centuries. He was not one of them.

  171. Makia January 5, 2007 10:56 am

    Zephyr, first of all, Ghengis Khan is another example, and he’s not known for being a vessel of peace. But he did bring peace by many standards. So your comeback loses a little bit of fire there. Second, i’m going to look into where i got that from and i’ll get back to you. Your “defense” of JPII in #161 doesn’t disprove my accusation. If i can’t give a reasonable backup for my accusation i’ll let you know, but for now i’m a cynic on this issue.

  172. Makia January 5, 2007 10:58 am

    Just read #169. Gotcha. Peace brother.

  173. Rich January 5, 2007 11:17 am

    Hey kia, I’m with you all the way on this stuff, global markets are all down, gold is plummeting, oil is at a two year low, Bush is hiring and firing Admirals, Generals and Intelligence Agency Heads like there is no tomorrow, and the fleet is now assembled in the Persian Gulf.

    On top of that it appears some Israeli military types are calling for a strike on Iran ASAP:


    Some interesting analysis here.

    I’ve looked around for some interpretation of global financial events in the past few hours but can’t find anything current that deals with all of the down markets and commodities, perhaps in the next few hours the articles will start to appear. This looks like the lull before the storm, but who is selling off and why would you sell oil and gold in to a war in the Gulf?? Seems to me these commodities are about to spike MUCH higher, must be short covering?

    Bottom line is that STUFF is HAPPENING! Heads up, it’s time to watch very closely.

    Cheers Rich

  174. bp January 5, 2007 11:37 am

    Dr Jane #150 - I’d have to say that article falls in line with other sources I’ve seen, but it is (it seems) 2 years old. Highly probable senario - As kia said - warfare today is asymmetrical - too bad we always fight the last war, instead of the one we have, like walking into the future backwards - crusing for a bruising

    kia RE: #163 - “can you identify a government not in the hands of the wealthy?” - you got me there bro, heh, but…where do you draw the line on - “Either we hang together, or we hang separately” - I don’t like the way things are, but I would rather try to make it (government)work than destroy it.

  175. Makia January 5, 2007 11:46 am



  176. Rich January 5, 2007 11:50 am

    Makia are you on the bottle again??!!

    Get yourself together man!



  177. Makia January 5, 2007 11:56 am

    My take on government is that as long as the trend of globalization and consolidation continues, the vast majority of all humans on the entire planet are screwed. Screwed screwed screwed. 98%. Screwed.

    The only was to move toward remedy is to move toward localization. This is a perilous journey and will probably only come about through cataclysim, not choice. Until then 99% of the human race will be at the device of the 1%. We don’t need everyone to change their thinking here, but the critical mass is far from being reached. This is a global struggle, and honestly the Americans (average American Joe and Jane) don’t have very much influence, though we do have more opportunity. Another aspect is that for the Americans particularly, things are going to get darker before they get lighter. Its already pretty dark most everywhere else.

  178. Makia January 5, 2007 11:57 am

    (even in the event of cataclysim, choice is still the only way)

  179. Makia January 5, 2007 11:58 am

    (the lack of average american influence is simply a matter of numbers, not neccesarily of heart)

  180. zephyr January 5, 2007 12:13 pm


    Thanks for the initial link Rich. Another example…43 Jewish congressmen. Less than 2% of the population. And people wonder why Israel dictates, the US takes notes. Most are democrats. So, no way in hell do we back out of Iraq, and why we are likely to do something with Iran, even when Bush is out of the picture and a Dem takes the White House in 08. I wouldn’t have a problem if their first priority were US interests, but most Jews have primary loyalties to the Motherland. That’s why the US constantly goes against it’s own interests and against any Arab nation where Israel is involved. Does this not trouble anyone else?

    You have to give Israel credit. They’ve taken over the US from within through its powerful lobby with barely a whimper from Uncle Sam. It’s like the Borg….we have been assimilated.

  181. Makia January 5, 2007 12:25 pm

    You’ve gotta give those powerful Jews A LOT of credit. They are living much more than any “American” Dream.

    First you have the Money

    And then you have the Power

    And then you have the Women

    (what is that from. . .)

  182. zephyr January 5, 2007 12:28 pm

    Scarface….though I like Carlito’s Way better.

  183. Makia January 5, 2007 12:42 pm

    Thank you.

  184. Makia January 5, 2007 12:42 pm

    Scarface wasn’t Jewish, was he?

  185. Makia January 5, 2007 12:43 pm

    And why did they call him “Scarface?”

  186. Makia January 5, 2007 12:45 pm

    Okay, i’m done.

  187. kia January 5, 2007 1:04 pm


    Want is the name of your printing company?

    Bing, fun’s over:

    CRB 291.11 -1.50
    USD$ 84.63 +0.29
    Bonds 112.15 -0.25000
    Crude 56.31 +0.72
    Nat Gas 6.184 +0.022
    Gold 606.2 -16.7
    Dow 12405.30 -75.39
    Nasdaq 2433.26 -20.17
    S&P500 1409.80 -8.54

    Wild day, not sure all the downward pressure on crude is due to a warm winter in the N.E.
    Something is going down.

    bp, to regain representative government we must sever the flow of money to politicians and let them make decisions on the basis of votes from the citizens. Until then government will only serve money and those who have it. Time to get rid of a Congress that only doesn’t what it is told and paid to do by the monied. That’s what I call a peace dividend!


  188. Steve January 5, 2007 4:06 pm

    The deployment of yet another carrier battle group to the Red Sea- the USS Stennis- and the appointment of a US admiral to head up the MidEast/African command group while bagging the Army and Marine commanders (who did not request a surge a troops) shows a naval strategy against Iran is going to replace the ground campaign against the “terrorists”.

    Uncle Sam can do naval station duty with out high body counts and pressure sea routes of supertankers in and out of the oil fields. If recent news reports about Iranian oil shortfalls are accurate, they Iran is far more sensitive to Oil revenue interruption than previously assumed.

    So we stick ‘ em where they are soft.

    The stock markets see war-war rather than jaw-jaw and a newly elected hostile Congress making nice sounds while acting very arbitrary. This means tough tax laws on energy companies and war profiteers like Halliburton, who just so happens to have a foot in each of these Cheneyville’s garden spots.

    All this points to uncertain confrontation and huge volatility. Time to duck and cover, as we learned in the 1950’s??


  189. PB45 January 5, 2007 4:58 pm

    Hello Posters,
    I mentioned my last post my internet does not load web searches, I therefore cannot answer Dr Jane on two counts. I cannot recall now the use of the 2000 tons gold, but that was in the early 1990’s and long absorbed.
    Concerning modern warfare. I mentioned Brig gen. Victor Corpus and his description of each US weapon and each counter weapon that will be used by Iran. In one article called “Assassins Mace” a great compililation on new warfare. China, Russia & others have thru monetary necessity develop cheap and numerous weapons. missles and mining techniques. Some are simple suicide naval bombings, but others are complex and easily installed serviced and deployed( missiles & mines). Russia and China because of there land position (in the case of Russia) and their energy contracts (in the case of China have been supplied by both countries.
    It is obvious with Hezbollah’s stalmate in Lebanon the Shites are emboldened vs. both Israel & the US.
    KIA got it right it is a new world in military ordinance and strategy.
    The poster who wants proof why not just study the global analysts progression of the Leo Wanta saga step by step (starting with the award in April 2006) here:
    Archive of ‘Click Here’ Announcements arranged in date order
    As for the poster who thought I was somehow rude, I was referring to the amount of time they spend in reseaching things that are of interest to them. I know you are busy and most people work.
    I myself am a financial analyst. I trade and spec1alize in currencies and metals. Yet I find the time to D & D anything I deem of value or can affect the political landscape.
    As to the poster who is surprised to see gold at $605. This was no surprise at all. The chart patterns, the recent COT activity and the demonizing of all metals, oil and the CRB made it easy to predict. This is the recession that always precedes the hyperinflation.
    Govts (the Fed) is or will panic when they see a deepening housing crash, consumer retail sales drop or rising unemployment and will deluge the market with liquidity. With the help of a cheap interest Yen landscape the carry trade will have a field day. This is the financial side of inflation as Dr. Aubie Baltin, PHD currently explains on Gold Eagle website. The other side is price inflation of actual everyday “things” (food, gas etc) we use. The spillover can happen if enough currency reaches the public which deems buying today is preferrential to buying higher tommorow.There needs a will to borrow additionally by corporates and individuals; hence the haste by the FED to induce normality. If no one will borrow a credit contract followed by recession/depression occurs. I suggest you read his essay (he is thorough, easy to understand and possesses sound fundamental economics and a historical perspective par none).
    The sometime poster is correct about being busy as I personally have neglected my T A backlog. He is correct to point this out. Now I leave you to your blogging. This blog has been my first and last blogging experience. My health does not allow me both.
    One caveat defend the our Constitution. Write your legislators and ask why the dissoultion of our rights. Ask them why Bush is allowed to singlehandedly to attack Iraq and enter a treaty with Mex & Can that will establish yet a new fiat currency./Peter

  190. bp January 5, 2007 6:09 pm

    makia #181 - that’s funny - I just finished watching Scarface with Al Pacino

  191. bp January 5, 2007 6:28 pm

    kia #187 - I’d say the federal government has to collapse, I’d be willing to give it up, heh - but what about the state government - do you want to take this down to the county, or just the city?

    Steve…anybody…is there much info out there on these Sunburn cruise missiles developed by Russia and bought by Iran - seems a naval war is not a good move for the US if they (Sunburns) are in fact a reality

    PB45 - hate to see you go - you’ve presented a lot of interesting info - maybe you can come back when you get a chance (and say where you think gold is going, heh) — thanks for the time you put in

  192. icemancometh January 5, 2007 7:12 pm

    Just TWO comments:
    1) there are plenty of willing borrowers to the FED’s debt creation. They are the money center banks that then invest the “cheap” money around the world and buy up assets with that cheap money. The money center banks borrow as much as they want and there is plenty of world to buy with dollars that will be worth less tomorrow. Nice business if you can get it! The extra dollars created by the Fed go abroad. We don’t even see them here.

    2) The deflation Mises talked about assumes that there is no global trade or that it is not the determinant factor in the national economy. In today’s US most goods are imported and the price will rise, not fall, as the dollar falls. There will be a slowdown in consumption but not deflation. Housing is just in correction due to a glut of new construction but other than upper-end homes, average home prices will stay in line with ability to pay based on monthly income which will stay nominally flat. For the consumer economy as a whole, stagflation is more like it, as goods and services cost more and people can consume less of them. Either way the US middle-class is toast. The elite will, as usual, benefit.

  193. PB45 January 6, 2007 12:30 am

    Hello Posters,
    I did read the replies before & after my last post. There was a post of the Wanta chronlogy that I cut and pasted-I was unaware the blogs don’t do that. So here is the direct website: http://www.worldreports.org/news
    Many posters are upset about an Iran confrontation. I would not be too concerned for several reasons. 1) Any conflict is by nature a limited engagemenr (meaning no land troops) 2) The US always destablizes it’s enemies long before they attack. There is opposition to the fundamentalists, but it is not a violent organized opposition. 3.) The naval armada maybe be diversionary in nature ie: after amassing they might split up and go to other global vantage points.4) The US has no backing for this conflict either domestically or internationally. Even Nato has balked, England is neutral and energy starved Euroland is downright against any participation. 5) War preparations cause huge runups and even natinalization of matal stockpile and limited war materials. there is no evidence in the spot markets of this.6) War at this point would be resultant in high deflationary market contractions (financial disruptions) 7) The Fed will surprise with the next interest move by increasing rates. Housing is done for and if that is the case so is consumerism as we knew it concluding with unemploment. The real role know is protetion of a USD$ collapse.
    So what is the upshot to all these possibilities? No or confined agression in Iran (as usual underestimating the reprisals.)
    Expect no help on a personal level from the govt initially concerning a housing, emplyment or tax rebate. The planned recession is coming. Foreign nations will competitively devalue along side the US to maintain their export advantage (Japan, China,Thailand, Korea, Taiwan, India). So expect a strong USD$ earl on in 2007.USD$ Hegemeny is paramount to our PONZI FED. Witness the fall in base metals, oil and the CRB as of late. If you had monitored leading indicators eg (Copper & Energy) it would have been telling you recession is upon us.
    Concerning POG. POG futures have a clear H & S pattern. The neckline at $615 was broken on friday’s close. Expect a minimum of $575 on the futures. Elliot Wave analysts see a lower move to $525 to $550 area.
    The poster who exclaimed they must have sold a ton of bullion on Friday. That is the equivent of 31,000+/oz or 3,000 futures contracts. Out of a daily avg volume on Comex is 65,000+ contract. That negates any LME, Chicago Bd of Trade, HK or Sidney market (which are low volume). The Japanese Topix is active with Goldman net short 34,000 contracts as of Friday a week ago. So a ton is meaningless really.
    Read Dr. Aubie Baltin’s article at this web it is very sensible dicussion of 2007. I highly recommend his archived letters.
    Once a recessary scare develops The Fed will quickly stem any stock market events, keep private placement & M&A activity going as well as the hedge fund carry trade. Expect more phonied stats from Washington and many incentives from Congress and maybe from the White House.
    POG upon fulfilling this last pattern and make the indicators all oversold we face other larger pattern that are in place. EWT also recognizes this as doe Gann Analysis. Some measurements depending on the pattern structure plays out to $838 are. Others are still over $800 level. Seasonality is a COT scam that has played out over many years. This year proved Indian weeding + Christmas word inventory buying means nothing overall on the demand side. Investor demand is what counts. Years prior to this little or no investor demand existed hence the COT played up seasonality scam.
    As for PM stocks. A valid POG recovery will always be led by the HUI miners. Your clue is to chart the individual mining stocks in that index. The explorers can act independently of bullion and even countercyclical(those may be the ones you want later).
    The final key is to watch the indicators and patterns as they play to their targets. Further scrutiny of weekly COT will help as a net short position (options & futures from 321gold) of -75,000 commitments. One must in clude options a it still is a commitant of 100/oz each. The recent trend is for the bullion banks (COT boys I call them) is to add more options than futures avoiding the margin calls and initial margins.
    POG is still in tact as low as $480’s major uptrendline (below that warrants a fresh assessment).
    The seeming attitude found on message bds and forums is just buy gold & PM’s and hold on. Trouble is for the older set this supercycle may conclude in 2015-2020. Many ups and downs will occur. Some will be downright scary. That is why expect traders such as Mr. Jim Sinclair recommend selling 1/3 holding on extensive overbought rallies (ie: May/06) and waiting to rebuy that 1/3 when oversold. Mr. Sinclair also, as I do, subscribes to keeping your gold in bullion (physical coins or bars)and away from safety boxes or confiscation. http://jsminset.com/
    Pm stocks need a different approch and must be analyzed individully. They must be bought cheap, prediscovery, but how do you know which ones. One reco for that is Mr Richard Arpel, Sr. from various webs like Safe Haven.com and FinancialSensense online. His lectures really are word on the explorers. See his archives and web search him his speeches and writings. http://www.safehaven.com/archive-270.htm
    I highly recommend Jim Pupulva’s 3 hr weekly broadcast review. http://financialsense.com/ Jim is a great speaker and keeps our interest on current market developments. A good predicter and analyst as well.
    There are numerous writers avoid the inexperienced new ones, the ones with services and letters to sell. Some are sincere, but many write what wants o be heard and that is $1,000, $2,000 or $6,000 POG. Yeah sure it probably will get there , but when is always the question. The webs I have recommended are tried and true for me so use them!
    A daily review of JSmindset will update investors in G & S as to events both political and G & S in nature. This is a daunting task, but if you are not willing to do the reading, interpreting and be will to do all the D &D necessary for success (that includes taking losses) the I advise you buy bullion on this dip and forget about the ups and downs. Not idyllic but in the longrun if you are young you will preserve your wealth.
    To the worried posters for their familes and children:

    America has existed for 200 yrs mostly isolated from war, famine and pestilence. The current politicians have sold us out for votes. It may very well be America will change it’s form of govt as the current generation seems clueless to anything non-hedonistic in nature.
    I love the US, I love the Constitution and have an unyielding trust in God. One anecdote and I am done.
    When I was young growing up in the 1950’s we as elementary school children were drilled weekly to train for nuclear attacks. Under desks, in stairwells, basement and hallways. The fear and spectre were always on our minds, but changed nothing in our personal attitudes and love of life. It shouldn’t now as it didn’t then. Peace to all./Peter

  194. Makia January 6, 2007 5:16 am


    “. . . Yet I find the time to D & D anything I deem of value or can affect the political landscape.”

    you got me there.

    Priorities are awesome.

  195. bp January 6, 2007 7:08 am

    Dr Jane - what’s your take on this article? - http://www.westonaprice.org/knowyourfats/oiling.html

  196. Tim January 6, 2007 9:15 am

    It’s not easy in today’s world to extrapolate any prediction based on the trends. I like Jim Puplava’s rogue wave theory. Something will come out of left field to start a process of world events, something no one has predicted. I am one who believes that Bush and those who are pulling his strings in the shadows have played one masterful game of chess. I believe the eye has been on the fact that they need to take Iran down all along. The Arabs in power do not want a powerful Iran and we are still close allies with most of the moderate Arab nations whether it looks troubled on the surface or not. The coming conflict with Iran has already been funded, whether or not congress decides to fund any such conflict does not matter. The funds are already in place, in the shadows. This entire Iraq operation, looking like it has been a quagmire, is just a strategic waiting game. Bush is now agreeing to add more troops to the Iraq mission, the only reason is that the time to hit Iran is drawing near. More troops will be needed to help prevent any border encroachments from Iranians who make it through the cloak of death from carpet bombing in that area. Where do the funds come from you ask? Where do you think all those funds that have apparently been pilfered from the Iraq reconstruction effort are? Most of them have been sheltered to provide the funding for the next phase in anticipation of a new democratic congress that probably would not provide funding for it. The game is on and will happen by labor day. Then the fed will lower interest rates. I agree with Puplava’s analysis that before that happens, there will be PTB induced dis-inflation. The dis-inflation from central bank controlled hedge funds and other banker mechanisms, hammering down commodity prices along with the Iran affair, will give the fed all the coherent reasons it needs to cut rates by one whole number before the end of 2007. Thus will begin another credit bubble, where will the credit go? hmmmm, perhaps capex, commercial construction, energy,,infrastructure refurbishment…more to come,…

  197. larry January 6, 2007 10:57 pm

    everyone be careful….about the religious stuff…i had a fascinating talk with a very mega billion type once….only once…nice sort, in an analytic way…he told me,only the riff raff care at all about religion….the gainers and monied care about ‘their’ religion…it is money. and the power of it…he made it clear in polite ways that as a physician i was his servant as were all other trades,,,,,,money becomes religion on many levels for the elitists….they use religious leaders to influence the riff raff to be more persuadeable for their needs,,,love,lots o love out there….religion is not love it is an other political derivative…man made and synthetic…and highly corruptable…dont shoot me..mho

  198. Mr. Samson January 7, 2007 8:11 am

    The picture is coming into focus now. We’re not seeing any deflation in commodities, just preparations for the inevitable strike on Iran’s nuclear ambitions. The Fed and other central banks are laying the financial groundwork so the economic shock from the event will be contained. They are driving dowm market prices for oil, gold, silver, etc. so the post-attack advances will be lower. Last Spring the U.S. Treasury printed $2 trillion in currency that is stored in warehouses ready for dispersal.

    On the military side, we see the gradual deployment of U.S. naval forces to the region as reports surface of Israeli preparations for a surgical air strike involving both conventional and tactical nuclear weapons.

    The leaks to news sources have a purpose as well — a final warning. If these revelations don’t convince the Iranians to alter their plans, the trigger will be pulled, probably in the next 30 days.

  199. kia January 7, 2007 8:30 am

    PB45/Peter (#189) So sorry to hear about your ongoing health problems. Is there anyway to keep in touch via the occasional email? Please let me know.

    Larry (#196) Religion is the politics of spirituality.

  200. zephyr January 7, 2007 8:47 am

    LIke I’ve always said, Larry and anyone else at this point, I can’t prove God exists. I can’t prove anything religious. You know, maybe it is all a scam to soothe the masses. Maybe aliens set everything up. Maybe UFO’s are actually us thousands of years down the line coming back to help.

    I’m not trying to force religion down anyone’s throat. I learned early on that’s just not something effective. You do more by living and by example than by talking. But most “religious” people talk because talking is easier, but it also sets you up to be a hypocrite. And since there are so many hypocrites, well that’s proof God must not exist because all religious people are bad or nuts or both.

    Personally, I have experienced moments in my life that cannot be dismissed so easily. Moments alone, quiet moments, times spent in prayer in the woods, times where something really bad should have happened to me but didn’t, almost like I was protected. Call it what you will. I really don’t care at this point. I’m at a stage in my life where I really don’t care what another believes as long as no one is getting hurt by another’s beliefs. By the same token, I expect the same from others.

    I have felt something tangible. I often liken God to a caddy. He might whisper in your ear how you should approach the 17th hole, but ultimately you have to play it. Of course I could be nuts. That’s fine, I’m comfortable with that.

    I’m also sorry I mentioned Pope John Paul II. By the reaction you would have thought I said Adolf Hitler was actually a pretty sweet, loving and thoughtful man. If you read my entire post, I am pretty harsh on THE Church over the centuries. There’s a reason I’m not with THE church anymore. However, I acknowledged a good man by his actions. Guess I was wrong. Guess I forgot this forum denigrates everyone and everything establishment. You’re right, he must have had ulterior motives. And Gandhi was a prick, too. After all, he left us with India and Pakistan on the constant edge of nuclear war. And Buddha was full of shit too. “The only way to end suffering is thru enlightenment which enables one to halt the endless sequence of births and deaths to which one is otherwise subject”? Ummm, got weed, anyone?

    No wonder the PTB have no threat to their game. The people are all so busy pissing on each other like children, that they don’t recognise who’s yanking their chain. I agree Larry. I’m sure $$$’s influence a great many religious leaders. But are you going to tell me that NOBODY is good? NOBODY is genuine? Those types of thoughts say much more about the person who is speaking, than whom they are speaking of. The elite may have made money their religion, but it doesn’t make it THE religion nor does it make them the gods they envision themselves to be.

    And Makia 164. Share your source of enlightenment. And it couldn’t have been JP I either since he was only pope 33 days. And many think he was taken out ala Kennedy because he was attempting to expose the corruption within the church. At least do a small amount of research before proclaiming something. A google search will tell you who was pope during the Nazi regime.

    Enough!! I promise not to type anything smacking of religion on these pages. I’ll stick with topics like $$$, the PTB and govt corruption. This way I’ll be assured of sticking to conspiracies and speaking badly of everyone’s intentions.

  201. zephyr January 7, 2007 8:48 am

    Kia 198 nicely said.

  202. Rich January 7, 2007 9:18 am

    I like this story.

    The Sunday Times writes the story that is then made in to a story by AP and broadcast in the US.

    The one interesting issue here is the claim the Israeli’s are using Gibraltar as a training base, simulating the distance for their aircraft, that kind of detail gives credence to the claim IMO.

    Israel Denies Planning Iran Nuke Attack
    By Associated Press

    4 hours ago

    LONDON - A British newspaper reported Sunday that Israel has drafted plans to strike as many as three targets in Iran with low-yield nuclear weapons, aiming to halt Tehran’s uranium enrichment program. The Israeli Foreign Ministry denied the report.

    Citing multiple unidentified Israeli military sources, The Sunday Times said the proposals involved using so-called “bunker-buster” nuclear weapons to attack nuclear facilities at three sites south of the Iranian capital.

    Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert’s office said it would not respond to the claim. “We don’t respond to publications in the Sunday Times,” said Miri Eisin, Olmert’s spokeswoman.

    Israeli Minister of Strategic Threats Avigdor Lieberman also declined to comment on the report.

    Foreign Ministry spokesman Mark Regev denied the report and said that “the focus of the Israeli activity today is to give full support to diplomatic actions” and the implementation of a U.N. Security Council resolution imposing sanctions on Iran for refusing to halt enrichment.

    The United States and its allies accuse Tehran of secretly trying to produce atomic weapons, but Iran claims its nuclear program is solely for peaceful purposes, including generating electricity.

    Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad has condemned as invalid and illegal the U.N. resolution.

    Though Olmert has not explicitly ruled out a military strike against Iran’s nuclear program, he has repeatedly said the issue should be dealt with diplomatically.

    Because an Iranian nuclear bomb would affect the entire world, Olmert has said, the problem must be solved by the international community.

    The Sunday Times reported that Mossad, the Israeli spy agency, believes Iran could produce enough enriched uranium to build nuclear weapons within two years. It also reported the top three targets for the Israelis were Natanz, where thousands of centrifuges are being installed, a heavy water reactor at Arak and a uranium conversion facility near Isfahan.

    Israeli pilots, the newspaper reported, have made flights to the British colony of Gibraltar to train for the 2,000-mile round trip to the Iranian targets.

    The Israeli army declined to comment when asked by The Associated Press on Sunday whether the Israeli air force was training for an attack against Iranian nuclear facilities.

    “I refuse to believe that anyone here would consider using nuclear weapons against Iran,” Reuven Pedatzur, a prominent defense analyst and columnist for the daily Haaretz, told the AP. “It is possible that this was a leak done on purpose, as deterrence, to say ’someone better hold us back, before we do something crazy.’”

    Ephraim Kam, a strategic expert at Tel Aviv University’s Institute for National Strategic Studies and a former senior army intelligence officer, also dismissed the report.

    “No reliable source would ever speak about this, certainly not to the Sunday Times,” Kam said.


    Associated Press Writer Matti Friedman in Jerusalem contributed to this report.

    I also like the way AP says “a British newspaper” like the elite Sunday Times is somehow disassociated from the centrally controlled, corporate media collective! This kind of reporting is serving to warn us all of what is coming in the not too distant.

    So, who thinks gold will sell off more? There is very strong support it seems at $600, I think there would be a lot of buyers if it goes much below that.

    Cheers Rich

  203. kia January 7, 2007 9:38 am

    Zephyr (#199) Love the image of your cosmic caddy!

    Rich (#201) Nice update on our terrorist client state. One wonders how far the NeoCons are willing to sell the US’s fortunes down the river for the benefit of the Zionists. I can only surmise that their allegiance to the Zionist agenda is stronger than upholding the US Constitution.

    I feel sorry for the average American/Palestian/Israeli/Lebanese/Iraqi/Iranian who would all benefit from the Peace that we come impose between the Palestinians and the Israelis. This Peace will only occur when power is taken away from the NeoCons and the Zionists.


  204. larry January 7, 2007 9:48 am

    kia…that is correct….relgion is the politics of spirituality….it is still,man made and as history shows prone to corruption and all that follows…religion is personal spirituality hollowed out and marketed for money and power…a basic human connection monetized…..holland legalized prostitution

  205. zephyr January 7, 2007 10:17 am

    So, Larry, is everyone corrupt? Is there no one good associated with religion? Or is each one of us just a spiritual being floating around? When religion is done right, spiritual individuals come together and form a community. Does that automatically make it corrupt?

    Communing is good. Much charity comes from organized religion. Is that bad? Is it blood money then? Alot of what you say exists. Not all! To paint everyone with the same brush is unfair to put in kindly.

    So once I come out of the woods and my one-on-one with God, if I head to church or synagogue or mosque, do I become hollowed out immediately upon entering the doors? Is it Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde? Once I cross the threshold, do I want to rob the elderly person and rape the alter-girl on the way out the door?

  206. FCT January 7, 2007 3:23 pm

    Yes, the problem is surely those “Zionists”. They are always going around telling the world that certain countries have no right to exist, and that country will be wiped off the maps. Their leaders openly talk about accepting millions of casualties in order to rid the world of a country that embarrasses them in nearly every sphere of human achievement.

    Yup, those darned zionists…

  207. zephyr January 7, 2007 7:41 pm

    Yup, those darn zionists…the ones who destroyed the shit out of Lebanon. You know, the ones who killed all those Lebanese civilians. The same zionists who have their own form of apartheid. Been to Israel, FCT? I have. Those sly zionists don’t treat Palestinians like human beings, but that’s OK because zionists are God’s chosen people.

    The same zionists who have all those weapons stamped “Made in the USA” ( we still make something, thank God!!). Iran huffs and puffs and blows hot air and is nowhere near close to hurting poor ol’ Israel. But thy shall pay the price nonetheless for insulting those poor perpetual victim zionists. After all, no other group of people in the history of the world have been afflicted like the zionists, or so we are reminded every few minutes or so.

    Oh, FCT, thank you for your enlightenment!

  208. zephyr January 7, 2007 7:46 pm

    Oh yeah Equal punishment for denying the holocaust….limited nuclear warfare….kill, kill, kill the gentiles…..sounds fair to me.

  209. larry January 7, 2007 8:21 pm

    199 zephyr….good and bad are a construct of mens mind’s and open to vast ranges of interpretations….we are of nature.period.departure from nature has led to endless tinkering with nature.we are experimenting with nature and by association ourselves.no one knows how it will go.how does it seem to be going?the new natural order is being established as we speak.it looks like no traditional or familiar order.it looks like a new synthetic order.we will be born to be borg?not so outragious.balance and harmony just seem to elude us…fear drives us for more security…others are,,,,, well others and hence expendable…women know instictually to find the most fit provider for offspring benefits….we are primordal and hate it…”if we all do our best then we all do the same” by Edward Bellamy,’looking backwards’…..we will never have a utopian socialized compassionate society during my time…that i do know…’man the manipulator’

  210. PB45 January 8, 2007 2:04 am

    Hello Posters,
    I promised in one of my last posts to find an article written by Brig. Gen Victor Corpus (PI). It is a two part discussion(actually a reparte)of the current US vs Iran weaponry published in the Asia Times.Basically of a comparison of attacking and defensive parries by the combatants. Shocking really.
    I believe Dr. Jane and poster Kia had particular interest in the seeming reversal of US military dominance. Excuse me if I have excluded other posters.
    Part 1
    “Striking where it hurts”
    Part 2
    “Assasin’s Mace”

    I made several posts regarding the ongoing saga of trusted aide and Ambassador Leo Wanta to President Ronald Reagan. I have no interest in debating anyone concerning Mr. Wanta’s already won in Virginia court, illegally held yet still unreleased funds by Bush, Paulson, Bearnake, Snow and Greenspan et al. The amount is a Trust fund begun by Regan in 1989 with approx 50yrs of SSS Trust funds of the US citizens. Wanta’s award was but a small part of the $37 trillion (compounded over 25yrs.) I have followed the unfolding events for a very long time. My first introduction was mentioned in connection with Mark Rich and Vince Foster dating back to the Clinton presidency.Below is the ver lastest update by Global Analysts.
    This edition concerns Sec Treasury Paulson’s flight to Israel since his arrest in Germany Dec 23, 2006 along with Vice Pres. Cheney.
    Basic background history
    Below is a chronology of all events over the past year:

    I have posted this once before, but if any poster wants to do his own investion as I have done, I have included mutiple webs all unrelated to the above Mr. Chris Story. The sites have multiple web and research within so this is not a Sunday stroll, LOL.
    These are webs researched and crosschecked by me as I believe this is one of the most important stories of the century. It is impossible for me to reatain all the facts and details from my findings and therefore let the posters make up their own minds. Plenty of CIA obfuscation and paid media has only added to the complex situation. The facts presented below are irretfuable as is the initial award of $4.7 Trillion.

    December 9th, 2006 at 10:08 am
    To Dr. Jane the following web I am 99% sure contains the answer to your query of the 2000 tons of gold. The web ia interesting and contains documents (certificates in Want’s name for large amounts), many interesting interviews, and even some CIA planted dissemination papers.

    To poster KIA. Thank you for your comments concerning my physical problems. For one moments, put yourself in my place (knowing my history) how completely disallusioned I must have been on seeing the government degenrate since the 1960’s and realizing all was in essence for aught. Tou mentioned you want to ask something further of me. The best way is to Contact Michael as he has my email address and ask him if he could give to you (I will only accept email from you though) So Michael I authorize you if it is not a rule against giving it out then it is fine to give KIA my email. Thanks to all posters here for your inquires and thoughts./Peter


  211. Dr Jane Karlsson January 8, 2007 7:05 am

    PB45/Peter, just been reading Victor Corpus at http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article15347.htm
    and he’s brilliant. Thanks too for the http://www.worldreports.org/news link. I had to read a lot of the Wanta stuff over many months to be sure it was true.

    Rich #202, that Sunday Times article is dynamite. How interesting that Olmert’s spokeswoman said ‘We don’t respond to publications in the Sunday Times.’ Remember it was the Sunday Times that published Mordechai Vanunu’s evidence on Israel’s nukes?

    BTW, I’ve been investigating your theory (#146) about the origins of gold, and I am sorry to have to tell you that you are misinformed and possibly even delusional. It’s gremlins, not leprechauns.

  212. Makia January 8, 2007 7:19 am

    Zephyr, this is the source of my accusation, but i haven’t gotten a chance to look it up. I’m going to try and do it today at lunch.


  213. Dr Jane Karlsson January 8, 2007 7:36 am

    zephyr #153, good questions, I don’t have any answers. Are they criminally insane, or just criminally ignorant?

    Something very interesting happened during the recent war in Lebanon which might shed some light on this. According to The Times, the Israeli army invading Lebanon was told to expect ‘a tent and three Kalashnikovs’, and found instead, a well-equipped tunnel system with hydraulically-operated steel doors.

    How on earth can the intelligence have been so wrong? This is Mossad! The most efficient and fearsome intelligence service in the world, isn’t it? And Lebanon is right next door! It was also reported that the Israeli Defence minister didn’t know, before the war started, that there were rockets in Lebanon. There were actually so many that they came over at 200 a day. The DEFENCE minister didn’t know?

    Then one remembers how the equally efficient and fearsome CIA got Iraq’s WMD so wrong that the inspectors went to site after site after site and not a single one had anything whatsoever to do with WMD. Some of them were out in the desert with nothing but sand for miles.

    How can this happen? Doesn’t it make you wonder whether the US Navy might actually not know about Iran’s Sunburns?

  214. Dr Jane Karlsson January 8, 2007 8:02 am

    bp #195, I haven’t read this particular article, but I’ve read several others by Mary Enig, and Enig & Fallon. They are excellent. The idea that saturated fat is bad for your heart, and refined oils are good, is one of the great food scams.

    The experiments apparently showing that saturated fat causes heart disease have been repeated with extra copper, and the rats did not get heart disease. Somehow the high-fat diet was causing copper deficiency.

    Have a look at this: http://www.survivediabetes.com/cleave.htm

  215. zephyr January 8, 2007 9:56 am

    Well, Makia, at least now I know where the X-Files got it’s primary story line from. Interesting. I read 40 reviews on this book and it’s seems opinions cover the spectrum. I googled 4 sites and read some of William Cooper’s writings. I finally found where he mentions JP II. So, that’s your source? I suppose anything is possible. I remember hearing of that book but never read it. I’m sure he had some real info but like David Icke, he probably goes to far. Some sources say he admitted as much in his later years. But again, who knows? Lots of unexplained stuff out there. I suppose we’ll know something come 2012. However, if that date comes to pass with nothing happening, perhaps we should throw the last shovel of dirt on the conspiracy corpse.

    As far as John Paul goes, I’ll refer to a simple and basic truth….You can tell a tree by it’s fruit….simple as that. I followed the man for 26 years. I remember the day principal Sr. Maria George came into our 8th grade class and told us we had a new pope and that he was Polish. Of course all the Italian kids had a good laugh and made the typical stupid comments, but I was intrigued being half Polish. I remember his first trip to the US and how he charmed and fascinated nearly everyone. He was so different I remember hearing. He was unlike prior popes because he was the people’s pope. So I followed him for 26 years and was amazed at his resoluteness in travelling the globe and bringing a message of hope to so many people who had none, many times right in the face of repressive regimes. And still I was astonished upon his death at just how loved he was.

    So is it possible it was all bullshit? He was just a prop to pacify the masses? I guess it could be so. But if that’s the case, then I guess nothing, and I mean nothing, can be believed with assuredness. And that’s beyond sad.

    No, I believe in good people. I believe Peter Jennings and Ed Bradley were 2 genuine good souls who travelled the globe and also gave voice to those who had none, because they saw so much. They were by far my favorite journalists. And now they are gone. And I really don’t see anybody on the horizon to replace these giants of good will. In a world of corrupt and selfish leaders, it was comforting to believe goodness was represented too.

    At least, that’s my belief.

  216. muleskinner January 8, 2007 10:03 am

    I found Waldo, where’s Leo Wanta?

    MGNU 55 cents, was $1.85

    DROOY 78 cents, was $1.58

    ZAAP 84 cents, was $2.14

    Some more deflation.

  217. kia January 8, 2007 12:02 pm
  218. kia January 8, 2007 1:38 pm


    Here’s one more link to add to the list I had posted as #216, which now seems to have disappeared. This is a good explanation of the recent shuffling of the deck chairs on the ghost ship USS Bush.


  219. khill January 8, 2007 3:49 pm

    “To witness oil fields in every part of the world peaking, but yet to claim that there will never be a global peak, requires an explanation completely divorced from conventional logic.”

  220. khill January 8, 2007 3:53 pm

    The Wanta “story” has roots in the “Economic Intelligence Review” a Lyndon LaRouche organization famous for it’s cult like tendencies see his bio http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyndon_LaRouche

  221. khill January 8, 2007 3:59 pm

    http://my.opera.com/prosperingbear/blog/ “Nasdaq downturn is iminent”

  222. bp January 8, 2007 5:08 pm

    #216 kia - that story is so Cheney, hehe - that guy (Cheney) must be a plant from Hell

  223. bp January 8, 2007 5:16 pm
  224. GEMSTOCKS January 8, 2007 5:59 pm

    We need a new thread. It takes longer to scroll down and find the last post I’ve read than it takes to read the new stuff.

    Where is that web wrangler that ask new questions?

  225. Rich January 8, 2007 9:10 pm

    Hey Michael.

    How about a thread for those interested in Wanta, perhaps trying to prove or disprove the myth/legend?

    Then a more general one on the dip in oil, the pounding gold just took, the markets being very shakey, the dollar shooting up, the fleet in the gulf, the attack in Somalia and imminent action in Iran, etc? Perhaps a “what does all this mean” kind of theme!!??

    Just a thought.

    Either way, this has been a great thread, they seem to be getting better and better - there must be meaning in that!>?


    Cheers Rich

  226. khill January 8, 2007 11:09 pm

    “what does all this mean”?It means the crap is hitting the fan at an accelerating pace and no one is in charge.Control is not possible on this sinking ship.Some will survive some won’t and luck is a major factor in both failure and success.This isn’t the end times but it’s going to feel like it and for many it will be.There is no crises management plan ,there might be a few post crises plans floating around but I wouldn’t count on it.Man is too ignorant and vain to pull off a smooth transition or plan for the post crises future.There are simply too many variables.After most of the planet looks like Iraq does then let’s see how we come together or don’t and rebuild.We are so intelligent and so foolish it’s amazing we made it this far.We are children with weapons of mass destruction.

  227. PB45 January 9, 2007 4:02 am

    Hello posters,
    I keep checking back to see if any posters have found any additional sources that confirm or enhance in mainstream media any of Ambassadors Wanta’s.
    Post # 216 Khill sites Wilkapedia as a reference to Mr. Wanta’s background was really a conspiracy by Lyndon laRouche.
    Checking Wilkapedia as I have for years on many subjects, but never use it as an authority or even a quotable source. Wilkapedia can change radically and even delete additions to the web. Anyway that is besides the point.
    I just updated my search and found the following story by non involved source:/Peter
    Wanta Know What is Really Going On?
    You MUST know!

    January 02, 2007

    By Taffy Rice (View author info)
    Copyright Taffy Rice

    Powder Springs, Georgia -
    Do you ‘Wanta’ know; maybe you do and maybe you don’t. In Georgia, bankruptcies are number 1 in the nation, thanks to new bankruptcy laws. Could that be an accident? So many property owners cannot understand the overt theft of their family, rights, and homes, yet the problem WILL affect EVERY American and the culprits are in plain view. The powers that be created a “cold war,” which was really a ‘red hot’ free for all to distribute debt internationally and subversively. As in all moneyed schemes, the piper has to ultimately be paid; meet Leo Wanta, an appointed trustor of TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS by President Ronald Reagan, intended to be distributed to America? Despite Wanta’s diplomatic ‘privilege’, he was ultimately extradited from Switzerland supposedly for a debt relating to Wisconsin back taxes in an abrupt and suspicious fashion. (Can’t imagine the use of government to deny lawful behavior by Americans…familiar tactic, isn’t it!?)And so begins the coming to pass of the REAL STORY!

    Henry Paulson, the former chairman and chief executive of investment banking powerhouse Goldman Sachs (a 9/11 benefactor) and Bush appointee to the Treasury Department upon appointment, stated the American debt was “manageable,” during his confirmation. Don’t forget, BOTH Democrats and Republicans easily confirmed Paulson. However the International Court of Justice did not view his refusal to address ever escalating debt and fund payment to be an option for Treasury Secretary Paulson, upon repeated refusals to address the call for outstanding debt satisfaction.

    Specifically, Paulson’s repeated refusal to pay the American 4.5 TRILLION debt called by Leo Wanta (see connections to Goldman Sachs and Citibank to name a few), were met with no less than a ‘do NOT pass GO’ in Germany by the International Court of Justice during December, while you were distracted by Santa…ho, ho, ho! Wantas’ efforts were key dating back to the Reagan Administration but the outstanding debt he refused to funnel or launder, had American Officials literally targetting Wanta himself. However despite tax claims and physical sidelining, the requirement to fund debt, was in Germany met by no less than a subpoena issued by the German Government for Paulson himself with another for Vice President Cheney forthcoming. For those not familiar with Leo Wanta efforts, look no further than your American Highways, Bridges, or Amtrak to name but a few.

    Time again, I have received calls regarding the jaded purchases of American trusts, streets, parks, and buildings being resold, which came as no surprise. The bank consolidations, mergers, acquisitions, and union busting fervor has ALL led to the same property theft; the redistribution of debt and assets internationally by the global elite and the related destruction of the American Dollar. And what was the collateral used for this massive effort, why your property interests, of course! With the courts as the implementors to invoke the bankers agenda, politicians were all to ready to cash in on the backs of constituents.

    But will anything change in this country? And will it happen quickly enough to avoid total economic destruction? Check prices in the housing market, (see GA’s ranking as number 1 in bankruptcies). Most people have no clue about the private corporation printing fiat currency, the Federal Reserve or the CIA control of federal as well as local governments. While the effort by Regan/Clinton/Bush to float debt and create a 1 world government, using American Assets against Americans continues to escalate with an occasional Abramoff, Enron, or Saddam sacrifice, to detract from the real play, where will this corruption and deception leave the American Economy?

    And with the latest economic revelation UNREPORTED by MAJOR MEDIA, will anything change? Without payment, the British Euro will be the currency to have or will even the Brits agree to it, while the American Dollar will be worth no more than Confederate Notes! Does that explain why a British plane flew Paulson out of Germany following his assurances that the debt would be funded? Paulson’s late arrival to the Ford tribute was NOT unnoticed. But more importantly is the ever increasing shift in international monetary markets. In addition to UAE Members swift move away from the US Dollar, more voices are starting to recognize the willful destruction of safe food supplies, clean water, and available resources. Maybe the reliance upon emergency funds subverted by executive order controlled by the Treasury Secretary and Fed Reserve Head, which reveal a fixed market, will obtain the proper scrutiny required for economic survival.

    But when our President moves his property interests to Paraguay, what assurance do Americans have of their future or rights? Maybe now you better understand the CAI agenda, the CIA/FBI Merger, and the current government complicity (all 3 branches), which have been literally obliterating property interests in this country. It’s time to wake up and demand justice! Otherwise 1929 was just a warm up, prelude, or intro. Welcome to the “Land of Opportunity,” being subverted to the detriment of Americans!

  228. PB45 January 9, 2007 4:19 am

    Hello Posters,
    More from Wilkapedia which I posted the exact web (one of about 20). Had Poster Kahill read the entire web he would have found many confirming webs-his choice of a web seems to be very selective. WHY?
    This is the web I was looking for Dr. Jane that mentions the 2000 tons of gold and the direct quote of buy/sell or loan therof./Peter
    “Bill Clinton’s Short-Term Notes”
    Asian-European, the CIA, and Mochtar Riady

    Meet Leo Emil Wanta. At one point Wanta had bank accounts at Metishe Bank in Moscow, Avenue Bank on the Champs-Elysee in Paris, Credito Italiano in Milan, Anker Bank in Geneva, Swiss Bank Corporation in Geneva, the Algemeine Spaar in Brussels, the Zentralsparkasse und Kommerzialbank in Vienna, Creditanstalt Bankverein in Vienna, and–the perennial favorite of money launderers–Citibank in Milan, New York, and Los Angeles.
    Meet Leo Emil Wanta, a man accused of, or praised for, crashing the Russian ruble over 1990-1. There is no doubt that he was a currency trader, placing orders for 100 billion rubles at a time. Then there is the matter of gold–Russian gold.

    One of the orders faxed around the world from his New Republic/USA Financial Group Ltd. (2101 North Edgewood Avenue, Appleton, WI 54914, Tele/Fax: (414) 738-7007), dated Feb. 4, 1991, is an offer to buy/sell/effect 2000 metric tons of gold bullion, with rollovers under London good delivery. At the time of this offer, Wanta was in constant phone contact with Roberto Coppola in Rome, where Coppola served as Ambassador of the Russian Republic. Was it Russian gold Wanta was selling?

    Was Wanta just another trader specializing in illiquid currencies and flight capital in the form of bullion? Was he a big time money launderer? Either would explain the 14 percent commissions at which he dealt. Or was neither the case? Let’s look closer. Because something doesn’t add up.

    Wanta, an erstwhile travelling companion of Vernon Walters and supplier of machine guns to Bill Casey, was arrested by Swiss authorities on July 7, 1993, in Geneva, Switzerland. He was held for four months, then extradited to Wisconsin to stand trial for state taxes owed for the years 1982 and 1988. The grand total of taxes owed–$14,000.

    Curious that. Extradited for $14,000? In taxes? From Switzerland? The story gets weirder.

    Wanta was sentenced to 22 years in prison. (Better he had killed a few people than that he owed taxes.) Afterward, on Sept. 21, 1996, Wanta wrote a mysterious letter to Hillary Rodham Clinton, referring to “U.S. President Bill Clinton’s Short Term Notes and IMF Sale of Bullion.” In the letter Wanta referred to his own “de-stabilization of the Soviet Union Rubles (SUR)” and noted that he “prevented the Soviet & Italian Mafiosa from the Soviet Funds in favour of our U.S. Treasury & Metals Accounts in excess of US$ 150 billion”.

    Wanta then threatened: “Until by legal release from the un-consitutional/ false incarceration in Wisconsin–as a diplomat & non-resident–I am legally interested in the corporate placement of short-term notes & I.M.F. gold bullion/troy ounce delivery contract. Thank you for your kind assistance in this timely situation.”

    Wanta’s letter (or letters) got results. On Jan. 10, 1997, Wanta received a reply from Erskine Bowles at the White House.

    Mr. Leo E. Wanta
    c/o Kettle Moraine
    Correctional Institute
    P.O. Box 31
    Plymouth, WI 53073

    Dear Mr. Wanta:

    Thank you for your
    letter. I appreciate
    hearing from you.

    To give your concerns the
    proper attention, I have
    forwarded your letter to
    the Office of Agency
    Liaison within the White
    House. You can be certain
    that your concerns will
    be carefully reviewed.

    Again, thank you for


    Erskine B. Bowles

    On February 1, 1997, after Bowles had checked with W.H. Agency Relations, Leo Wanta was released on $90,000 bail.

    So here’s what we know about Wanta so far: Extradited from Switzerland on a triviality. Sentenced to 22 years on the same triviality. But then sprung after references to “Bill Clinton’s short-term notes” and the White House checks with Agency Liaison.

    Then there’s the Russian currency/gold issue. Wanta was dealing in billions of dollars. Where did the financing come from? Another question comes to mind: How did Wanta get to be Ambassador from Somalia?

    Claire Sterling’s not-so-reliable book Thieves World contains a good bit of information (and mis-information) on Leo Wanta. (Sources include a mysterious Mr. X, an “investment banker”, and an unnamed FBI agent. Sterling’s credits, however, may identify the latter source: she gives special mention to “Jim Moody of the FBI”–the man who headed up the FBI’s organized crime division.

    Wanta himself identifies Sterling’s “Mr. X” as Treasury Special Agent Philip Wainwright.

    Depending on your point of view, Wanta is a con artist or a hero: bilking the crumbling Soviet empire of its currency and resources, helping pushing the wounded bear over the cliff. Wanta’s operation has been called the Great Ruble Scam. That is, one of the few ruble scams not engineered by the Russian central bank/Russian government itself.

    Wanta presented his credentials in Moscow in October 1990. He was a member of Reagan’s “President’s Club” (meaning he had given $50,000 to the campaign). He also headed the “New Republic Financial Group” located in Appleton, WI, and registered in Vienna, Austria (New Republic/USA Financial Group, GES.m.b.H., Kartnerstrasse 28/15, Telefon: 513-4235, A-1010 Wien). New Republic had declared capital of about $17,000, according to Sterling. On this basis, Wanta wanted to swap $5 billion for 140 billion rubles, rising over five years to $50 billion for 300 billion rubles.

    You never make money unless you think big, right? The proposal (one of three similar ones from seemingly disparate sources) was to be a mini-Marshall plan to import into Russia consumer goods like frozen chickens and Tampax. Or that was the story. Boris Yeltsin approved the deal, but it fell through, according to Sterling, when the State Department reported that Wanta “had major debts and some credit card problems”. (Wanta denies that the State Department ever issued such a statement. Much of Sterling’s information, in fact, seems to come from a Soviet investigator looking to smear Wanta as a common criminal.)

    To Sterling’s “Mr. X”, who worked with Wanta, the objective was quite different: “I knew there would be a possibility of a Western privately orchestrated economic Jihad that could help crush the communist ruling powers by destroying their unstable ruble. Unilaterally and privately, I decided to play a catalytic role to crash the ruble.”

    During the previous year Wanta’s group bought sold and traded rubles. Many of the orders/offers appear to be bogus–calculated to cause a run on the ruble.

    And–coming forward to October 1990–Wanta’s deal of $5 billion for 140 billion rubles, or 28 rubles to the dollar, would have been transacted at roughly double the value of the dollar relative to its black market rate which was closer to 14 rubles to the dollar. If executed, the plan would have effectively given Wanta a free 70 billion rubles with which to help himself to the natural resources of a crumbling empire. Not bad. Who was Wanta representing? Himself? Or the U.S. government?

    Moving forward to Jan./Feb. 1991, we find Wanta in the process of moving two thousand tons of gold–during a time period when coincidentally two thousand tons of Soviet gold mysteriously disappeared from the Central Bank.

    By December 1991 Wanta and his partner Kok Howe Kwong had set up a food for petroleum joint venture in Moscow. Accounts in dollars and rubles were opened at Status Credit Bank in Singapore by the two through Asian-Europa Development Pte Ltd. Asian-Europa proceeded to export Soviet petroleum and import Western goods at an exchange rate (oil for goods) very favorable to Asian-Europa. Asian-Europa appears to be a U.S. government/CIA proprietary company set up under USCA Title 18, Sec. 6., Line 11. And it appears to have had a relationship with Mochtar Riady’s Lippo Group.

    Without a doubt, Wanta dealt the fading Soviet apparatus a body slam or two. Does that make Leo Wanta an American hero? And if so, why was he incarcerated? Was it just to keep him off the streets because of what he knew (a standard maneuver in the intelligence community)? Does that explain Wanta’s bogus extradition from Switzerland? Or was Wanta just a clever con artist who could somehow come up with the contacts and billions of dollars necessary to deceive a crumbling superpower, not to mention the CIA and the U.S. Treasury? Either way, Wanta ain’t your average used-car salesman. Wanta may be a victim railroaded by the government he served.

    Leo Wanta was appointed Ambassador of Somalia for Switzerland and Canada in March 1993. In July, Wanta had been in Switzerland to make $250,000,000 available for the Children’s Defense Fund at the request of Deputy White House Counsel Vince Foster. Children’s Defense Fund? Whose idea was that? What was going on there?

    Shortly after Wanta’s arrest, and following his daughter’s birthday on July 20, 1993, the Superintendent for the Swiss prison where Wanta was being held came by and told Wanta that Wanta’s friend Foster had been murdered.

    Wanta used to visit FBI Director William Sessions at his office through a secret entry known as the “back of stage”. There he would nearly always meet with a Mr.Gonzalez and a Mr. Jim Moody, who were the FBI enforcers for RICO and organized crime issues. Moody was the head of the FBI’s organized crime section.

    Can any of this shed some light on the death of Vince Foster? Clearly Foster was engaged in some major financial dealings–including the $250,000,000 for the Children’s Fund that Wanta discusses. Foster’s financial dealings may not explain why he was killed. But they could very well explain why there was no investigation.

    What does Wanta think?

    August 26, 1997
    Web Page: http://www.aci.net/kalliste/

  229. larry January 9, 2007 6:34 am

    224 khil…yes…we were meant to be children…children of ‘god’….we would be good at that if given a chance….we are not good at being adults….again, makes you come back to thinking we are the children of a supreme creator….we know we are deficient and that we lack sufficient wisdom and ultimate knowledge….yet ‘we’ and our leaders are forced to make choices and decisions daily from a place of inadequacy….so.the elitists,knowing this,create their game that they can own and rig and win at…they then believe they are god-like and better than the riff raff they baffle with bull- shit lies and distortions…this would tend to create fractionations and tensions an this earthly paradise,no?…..look around at what elitism has caused…..join a nudist colony and get real.ha

  230. bp January 9, 2007 7:51 am

    larry, zephyr, makia - what are your opinions on this article? - http://www.agoracosmopolitan.com/home/Frontpage/2007/01/08/01288.html

  231. kia January 9, 2007 8:31 am

    bp (#220) Cheney/Bush is the dark side of the American Dream. Silly me, I thought Nixon was the worst president in the history of the US.


  232. muleskinner January 9, 2007 9:00 am

    How much money is two thousand metric tons of gold?

    373 grams in a troy pound, about three troy pounds for every 1100 grams. One million grams to a metric ton.

    1 000 000/454 = ~2200 pounds.

    1000000/373 = approximately 2681 troy pounds per metric ton.

    5,362,000 troy pounds in 2000 metric tons.

    12 times 5362000 pounds of gold equals 64,344,000 troy ounces of gold.
    that times $600.00 equals 38.6 billion dollars for Leo.

    If you’re selling gold, that would be the way to do it.

  233. zephyr January 9, 2007 9:33 am

    Bp, obviously you made it to the same link that pb45 sent out. Yeah, I saw that, but I was much more interested in the article about large amounts of methane being released from the ocean floor which would dovetail perfectly with what happened in New York yesterday, where thousands smelled something foul which they thought was some sort of biological/chemical attack. Anybody else think it’s odd the cherry blossoms are blooming in DC NOW instead of in April. In southern Ct where I live, we haven’t had a winter, at all. Sat. it reached 70 degrees!!!! All my spring flowers are blooming!!

    But I digress from your original question. Honestly, I don’t know what to think. I’ve always said I can’t prove my beliefs so I would think what these people are saying is mere speculation too. Possible? Yes. Likely? Who knows. They make an interesting argument. Like it’s been said in finance, when everybody believes the same thing, generally it is wrong. Could be the same thing regarding all our man-made religions. I still believe in a divine creator. You can’t tell me the cosmos popped into existence just like that. Aliens? Why not? It would be awfully arrogant of us to think we’re absolutely alone in this vast universe.

    Who was Jesus? That’s the trillion $ question (inflation adjusted of course). He definitely was someone of note. People back then witnessed something significant because people don’t just voluntarily die mercilessly by the thousands for something they don’t really, really believe in. Those folks witnessed something. But how do you explain the pyramids popping up in different areas of the world around the same time? What about Stonehenge and Easter Island? The Mayans? Or the fact that humans became self-aware at some point. I don’t know, BP….simple as that.

    But alot of prophecy points to these times. You can’t dismiss it all as lunacy. The whole world can’t be reduced to science. That just displays a limited mind. My gut tells me something will make itself apparent in the not to distant future. In the meantime, like the little lady in Poltergeist said, ” Now hold onto yourselves. There is one more thing. A terrible presence is in there….so much rage and so much betrayal. I’ve never sensed anything like it. I don’t know what hovers over this country but it was strong enough to punch a hole into this world and take your constitution away from you. It keeps George W very close to it and away from the spectral light. It lies to W. It says things only a child can understand. He’s been using Cheney to restrain the others. To W, it simply is another child. To us, it is the beast.”

    “Now, let’s go get our country back.”

  234. confused January 9, 2007 9:44 am

    Ok for you that have read, digested, and most importantly understand this Wanta “theory” could you please explain in simple terms the following:

    who owes Wanta?

    How much is owed to Wanta?

    What are these funds owed to Wanta to be used for?

    How will that help anyone?


  235. zephyr January 9, 2007 9:51 am

    And how reliable are these sources you quote PB45? For example, the letter written to Hillary Clinton. Who would be privy to such info, and then be able to release it? Not to be a dick, but this one is hard for me to swallow. And this coming from someone who believes Aids/Ebola are manufactured viruses for population control. That actually seems to make more sense to me than Wanta. As I’ve said before, where exactly do you hide that sum of money? I mean, that’s alot of dough to stuff under the mattress.

    Having said all that, I don’t discount it, it’s just hard to know what is possibly true and what is just someone’s grand imagination.

  236. kia January 9, 2007 9:52 am

    Brother Zephyr,

    The Mayan calendar ends in 2012 as does the 26,000 year cycle of the Manavantara. Many point to 12/21/2012, the winter solstice which will set up some incredible planetary alignments.

    As for Belief, I like you don’t know and probably never will. That is why I prefer ideas, because I can pick them up, try them on, and put them down. I have no use for belief because I think it is harmful to a functioning mind, a developing spirit, and most importantly perilous to world peace.

    Observing the world’s monotheistic religions, they share once concept, the belief that they are right. Despite the fact that the Christians, Jews, and Muslims were all in the same place, at the same time, witnessing the same events, the next two thousand years of fighting and countless loss of life hasn’t settled much. Observation shows us that our ultimate future is a mystery to everyone of us. None of us know what lies beyond our death. If we could all accept the mystery, dispense with our belief systems and see the world for what it is, we could take a significant step toward peace and respect for all people.

    Our century old habit of regime change is one that we have practiced since 1893 starting in Hawaii and has moved through the Philippines, Cuba, Guatemala, Indonesia, Iran, Chile, Bolivia, Nicaragua, Panama, Afghanistan, Iraq and maybe Iran soon. We believe that we have a right to control the world’s energy sources through our creation of “Pipelinestan.” We are offended when Hugo Chavez in Venezuela or Evo Morales in Bolivia advance the idea that sovereign countries have the right to use their resources for the benefit of their citizens, rather than our multinational corporations.

    The U.S. has invaded sovereign countries 201 times since WWII motivated by the belief that the Americans are a peace loving people. Our belief in Perpetual War for Perpetual Peace would certainly make George Orwell smile. As a result of our beliefs we are involved in yet another crusade in the Middle East based on the belief that resources contained in sovereign countries are ours for us to use or more often waste as we wish. We believe that we were right to drop atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki to hasten the end of WWII, but are outraged when we are targeted by bombings of the U.S. Cole, our embassies in Kenya and Tanzania and the World Trade Center in 1993 and again in 2001.

    We believe we have the right to the services provided by illegal immigrants picking our crops, mowing our lawns, cleaning our pools and raising our children, but are outraged when they demand a path to legalization.

    Beliefs in our democracy lead the government to limit the availability of abortions, stem-cell based medical treatment, science education, and same sex marriage. Never mind that gays and lesbians alike are both entitled to equal protection under the law as enshrined in our constitution.

    Ideas expand one’s horizons and our capability to best observe our world. Ideas can motivate actions which have the power to transform ourselves and the world we inhabit.
    Belief places one’s mind in a hermetically sealed can that precludes it’s receipt of additional information. Beliefs constrain our ability to consider the ideas of others and respect their human rights. Beliefs limit our ability to change our own minds and further our own personal development. Belief is a one way dead end.

    Our beliefs are sowing the seeds of our own destruction. As we lurch into 21st century, the world’s only superpower who believes that military strength preserves our security finds itself alone, soon to be surpassed by Asian economies who understand that security in this young century is based on economic power. Meanwhile our adventurism undermines our security.

    Our beliefs are blinding us to the facts of today’s world and are hampering our ability to make sound decisions and take effective actions to preserve our security and further world peace. We cling to them at our own future peril. It it time to put our beliefs aside and see the world for what it is…a glorious Mystery. This recognization outweighs all the beliefs in the world.

    Our ability to forge a durable Peace, and solve the energy/climate change problem will be determined by our ability to come to agreement with those who hold different beliefs from ourselves.


  237. skeptical January 9, 2007 9:54 am



    the first paragraph of that article says:
    “They believe so-called 97% non-coding sequences in human DNA is no less than genetic code of extraterrestrial life forms.”

    The article NEVER attempts to support that conclusion it just goes from that point as if that point is somehow self evident.

    HOW did they get from non-coding DNA sequences to being from genetic code of ET? Do they have some ET genetic material to which they can compare human DNA to?

    Is is not that I dont believe in ET, I know they there are probably millions of advanced civilations out there. BUT this article is pure speculation, although I also beleive that we were created by some “ET”. Even if God put us here do you think that “he” would no reuse a design “he” had mastered somewhere else?

  238. kia January 9, 2007 10:40 am
  239. bp January 9, 2007 11:54 am

    zephyr #231 - “Now, let’s go get our country back.”

    yeah, I’m with you on that, but I say the time is not yet - have to wait for the Crisis to arise, and it will come - we are due - I’ve been reading The Structure of Scientific Revolutions, and The Fourth Turning simultaneously and they come very close to the same pattern - for things to break the old paradigm there have to be problems arise that indicate it no longer accounts for all events it should - we can see these problems coming up now, but still no crisis in the minds of enough people.

    #234 skeptical - yeah - I would have to agree - that was a jump in logic, hehe - if we don’t understand it, it must be extraterrestial - but i leave the matter open, it sounded like the guy making the claim was educated, but it seems that doesn’t mean a lot anymore

  240. kia January 9, 2007 12:08 pm

    FWIW “junk dna” is a term for “dna we don’t understand.” Recent work has shown this dna to be the key in determining how genes get expressed. This dna allows the range of dogs we see.

    It would be so much easier if we just said we don’t understand things rather than jumping to conclusions. How did author obtain the samples of extraterrestial DNA to compare with the “junk DNA”. The article is specious on it’s face.

  241. kia January 9, 2007 12:38 pm
  242. zephyr January 9, 2007 2:43 pm

    I’m with you BP, timing isn’t quite right yet….actually I was just having a little fun quoting the Poltergeist lady and applying it to our times. I must say I thought it was kinda funny…..hope it made someone else snicker….if they remembered the movie and understood the reference….otherwise it was just stupid ;-)

  243. larry January 9, 2007 3:05 pm

    228 bp….pure editorialization…a sort of he said she said they believe opine article…i love free press…blog on garth…..since we have genes they must have genes also….since genes are so complex,they must have come from outer space…..since aliens come from outer space and have genes our genes came from aliens….,,,,,,,,those aliens the article refers to attended YALE…they know GWB..they are members of skull and bones….GWB is a member of skull and bones…thus,GWB is also an alien….but not laura who is a librarian….i dated a librarian once,though she was an alien i believe

  244. bp January 9, 2007 4:11 pm

    Micheal I think we ought to ask this dude to guest blog here - http://www.smirkingchimp.com/node/4574

  245. Rich January 10, 2007 6:54 am

    Here is Russell Randall’s economic predictions for 2007, very well presented and thought-out, I love the logic of the Austrian argument, it just makes so much sense!


    Where the heck is Michael?? He must be off trying to make his fortune somewhere!

    Cheers Rich

  246. Dr Jane Karlsson January 10, 2007 7:43 am

    Michael, I am trying to get to grips with the Mises article you reference in The Specter of Deflation, and I am having trouble. What, for instance, does this sentence half-way down mean:

    ‘Everything that has been asserted with regard to the effects of any increase in the supply of money proper as far as this additional supply reaches the loan market at an early stage of its inflow into the market system.’ ?

    Is there a simple summary of Mises’ thoughts on this topic?

  247. Rich January 10, 2007 8:40 am

    Hey Jane.

    Great question, what the hell does that mean!? Mises probably spoke in German and was badly translated, or he spoke in bad English!

    Michael, answer the good lady! Perhaps with a twist of Prechtarian deflationary philosophy!?

    Here’s a story everyone on this blog should be interested in:

    The Top Privacy Issues of 2006 and what to look out for in 2007 (from the Electronic Privacy Information Center):


    Cheers Rich

  248. Rich January 10, 2007 8:53 am

    OK, last post for now, but this one is something I’ve been waiting on for some time and it all makes sense now:


    When the Gates and the Rockefellers start pitching “life saving” philanthropy in Africa you know something is happening. The truth about what they are up to is coming out and it ain’t pretty, and it is very disappointing.


  249. kia January 10, 2007 9:27 am

    Rich (#247,248),

    Good posts. I continue to be amazed by the identity theft industry. With the availablility of “strong” encryption technology why is it that these databases don’t utilize them to protect privacy?

    As for Gates, Hawken’s quote at the end of the article is right on. Several years back I had the opportunity to present the Gates foundation with a low cost proposal for developing clean water sources on a village based level. They politely told me that their “public health” efforts would be limited to support of pharmaceutical products which are priced out of the reach of those that Gates purports to serve.

    What else can you expect from a monopolist who can’t bother to build virus protection into his OS design?

  250. larry January 10, 2007 5:44 pm

    NAILED IT:http://www.financialsense.com/fsu/editorials/gnazzo/2007/nworder/0109.html

  251. kia January 10, 2007 7:27 pm

    “The essential act of war is destruction, not necessarily of human lives, but of the products of human labour. War is a way of shattering to pieces, or pouring into the stratosphere, or sinking in the depths of the sea, materials which might otherwise be used to make the masses too comfortable, and hence, in the long run, too intelligent. Even when weapons of war are not actually destroyed, their manufacture is still a convenient way of expending labour power without producing anything that can be consumed”.
    George Orwell, ‘1984’

    GWB marches onward.

  252. Dr Jane Karlsson January 11, 2007 3:50 am

    Where are you Makia? I am missing you again.

    Where are you zephyr? Please, please don’t stop discussing religion on these threads. No trained theologian does it better than you.

  253. zephyr January 11, 2007 6:04 am

    Thank you Dr. Jane, I very much appreciate your comment. For the most part I heard zero in response to any religious/spiritual comments I made. Except for a couple of notable rebuttals that were based on….what?….I’m not sure. So I figured my thoughts were just floating into space. Thanks.

    I am baffled as to how anyone without a lobotomy could even partially support our political elite. Their agenda is becoming so obvious. Like the deal the oil companies are setting up with the Iraqi “govt”. But the US is stuck in this false patriotism mode now where everything associated with the military is brave and noble. I always thought it so stupid to say “I’m against the war but I support the troops.” But the troops are mindlessly carrying out bad orders. Especially if many know in their hearts this whole charade is wrong and they still go out and follow orders. That’s why such young men are sent out to fight. Because they’re pliable, easily controlled and expendable. Words are very cheap….words like honor, duty, “protecting our freedom”, “protecting our way of life”. What is our way of life? Really.

    I cover sporting events, so I hear the national anthem all the time. Usually I want to smack the person who just sang because it sounded like an audition for American Idol. I read an article in yesterday’s USAToday, where most of the next generation, 18-25, their main goal in life is being rich and famous. AND they believe it will happen!! Convinced of it. Boy, most of them are in for a major letdown. So, that’s what we stand for? Maybe Larry was right, the PTB have made money their religion and the rest of the populace is right there kneeling before the money tree.

  254. zephyr January 11, 2007 6:06 am

    Except the money tree ain’t what it used to be.

  255. Dr Jane Karlsson January 11, 2007 7:12 am

    PB45, thanks again for the links on Wanta’s gold. I think I have the picture now, as far as one can on this subject. I didn’t know Wanta was/is a CIA agent, involved in ‘Black Ops’. That would be the ‘clandestine purposes’ you mentioned. Exactly what I wanted to know.

  256. Dr Jane Karlsson January 11, 2007 7:19 am

    BTW zephyr, now that Kastor has well and truly gone, I can tell you how much I appreciated your support at that time. He made me feel really bad, and you put it right. Thanks.

  257. zephyr January 11, 2007 7:23 am

    No problem…anytime….Kastor was just a bully and a knucklehead.

  258. Dr Jane Karlsson January 11, 2007 7:39 am

    bp, I’ve Googled the ‘alien DNA’ thing, and it appears that they’re not saying we have alien genes, they’re saying the non-coding DNA has a non-random sequence. This DNA has a structural role, and also an electromagnetic role, so perhaps it isn’t surprising that its sequence isn’t random. But yes, people are talking about aliens.

  259. bp January 11, 2007 9:00 am

    #258 - ah thanks Dr Jane for running that down, seems the media just twists things however they want to anymore

  260. kia January 11, 2007 10:34 am

    The stock market has all the earmarks of a blow-off due to its rich valuations. As a contrarian, I find recent surveys to be a warning that trouble lies ahead. The Russell Management Group in their quarterly money managers’ poll shows that 86% of advisors are bullish for 2007. Only 13% expect a flat market or a decline of 10%, and just 1% expects a decline of 10% or more. Business Week polled 80 analysts and 89% were bullish, 8% were bearish expecting a decline of less than 10% and just three expect a decline of 10% or greater. Those kinds of opinions send me running for the hills - a perfect contrarian scenario for a market decline.

  261. nestor January 11, 2007 12:31 pm

    13.000-14.000 Dow for ‘07. You heard it here months ago… it’s a bull market still. absolutely no signs of a top. no signs of a bear. the bears should pull thier heads out from the sand, and see the light of day.

  262. PB45 January 11, 2007 8:55 pm

    Hi posters,
    Poster Kia just alerted me to the latest Wanta developments ie: Paulson’s arrest and flight to Israel,A Bush war escalation(to include Syria & Iran) to camoflage the financial scope of his involvement + China & Vatican involvement as intermediaries.
    Dr Jane you have been a very polite and consciencious poster. I see religion and more aesthetic things are of interest to you. I hope my next article post will give you more insight in Wanta’s story. Now comes the demonizing they have (Ambassador Wanta’s lawyers) expected in reprisals. Blame the rape victum not the rapist is the next US govt angle. Cheers/Peter

    Friday 12 January 2007 02:57





    By Christopher Story FRSA, Editor and Publisher, International Currency Review, World Reports Limited, London and New York: http://www.worldreports.org. Press CLICK HERE and the ARCHIVE Button on the http://www.worldreports.org Home Page for Wanta Crisis reports since April 2006. Note: Due to NSA/CIA et al interference, some US users may find they can access worldreports.org directly, without the http://www. Mostly, http://www.worldreports.org provides access to our website at once.

    28 December 2006: An Attorney associated with AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., Thomas E. Henry Esq., issues on behalf of Ambassador Leo E. Wanta/Lee E. Wanta and AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., legal notification to President George W. Bush Jr. of circumvention and avoidance of payment of the $4.5 trillion Settlement. The text of this letter was posted on http://www.worldreports.org on 7th January 2007. A copy of the letter was distributed with the email version of the preceding posting in this series.

    30 December: On behalf of AmeriTrust Groupe Inc. et al, Thomas E. Henry Esq. issues legal notification to Ambassador John Negroponte, then Director of US National Intelligence, with respect to the circumvention and avoidance of payment of the $4.5 trillion Wanta Settlement and the ‘Reagan Protocol Funds’, illegal behaviour which has a direct impact on and implications for US national security, given that, as explained not least in our posting dated 2nd September, a rapid devaluation of the US dollar will ensue if the diverted $4.5 trillion is not released to AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. For the detailed background to the evolution of this biggest heist in world banking history, see preceding postings on this site.

    The text of this letter was posted on http://www.worldreports.org on 5th January 2007. A copy of the letter was distributed with the email version of the preceding posting in this series.

    31 December: Investigators inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that “1,500+ packages” relating to the “farm claims” [Reference: Savings and Loan swindles orchestrated by President George H. W. Bush and co-conspirators] are now sitting at the White House awaiting delivery release by President George W. Bush.

    01 January 2007: Michael C. Cottrell, M.S., Treasurer and Executive Vice President of AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., receives numerous telephone calls from alleged participants in the OMEGA OPERATION, a CIA/Langley sting operation [Reference: United States of America vs. Clyde Hood, Thomas W. Hofler Jr., et al]. These telephone callers indicate that the participants have been promised and advised that they will begin to receive their “payment packages” as soon as Ambassador Leo E. Wanta and AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., receive the diverted (stolen) $4.5 trillion Settlement funds agreed upon in May 2006 but hijacked by the White House and Henry M. ‘Conflict-of-Interest’ Paulson. The callers represent additional victims of CIA financial scams – good people who have been enticed to invest in CIA scams, members of the large community of the ‘broken hearted’* in America who have been taken for a ride by their own filthy, corrupt intelligence community – who have been maliciously directed to call Michael C. Cottrell, M.S., so that when it turns out that they do not receive their promised and long-delayed payments, they will be liable to blame the Ambassador, Michael C. Cottrell, M.S. and AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. In other words, AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. et al are being set up by CIA/OMEGA to take the heat when these parties are not paid. The senior present and former operatives masquerading as top office-holders behind these and innumerable other financial scams against the American people had better complete their rumoured immunity negotiations without delay, and in any case may find that they are unable to avoid the ‘lamp post’ solution that they richly deserve. [*Note: ‘Broken hearted’ is language used by one of our correspondents, suffering as victims of CIA financial scams].

    The criminal proceedings mentioned above refer to a CIA scam against Black churches. The criminal CIA subsequently targeted the White Middle Class. It is now plotting to decimate the White Middle Class completely, by destroying the value of its real estate [see below], which will probably trigger the Second American Revolution. If this happens, Americans should remain focused on where the enemy resides: answer: LANGLEY.

    02 January: Associates of AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., that the officials testifying before the Tribunal in Europe (Germany) against Mr Paulson, state that our report headed ‘PAULSON ARRESTED, SENTENCED IN EUROPE RE THEFT OF WANTA’S $4.5 TRILLION’ is accurate, and ‘on the money’, but that the Tribunal documents had been embargoed, at the request of Mr Paulson’s Attorneys. [Note: There may be more on this subject in due course].

    02 January: Investigators and associates of Ambassador Wanta and Michael C. Cottrell, M.S. inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., that, at the request of the United States, the British authorities obtained custody of Mr Paulson, the US Treasury Secretary, from the German authorities, and delivered Mr Paulson to Washington D.C. aboard a British aircraft, as we have reported, so that Paulson should ‘be seen’ at the late President Ford’s National Cathedral funeral service, and be present at a “Presidential Cabinet Rose Garden event by President G. W. Bush” [sic]; and that immediately thereafter, Paulson was flown to Israel to avoid having to be present when the German Chancellor, Madame Angela Merkel, visited the White House on 4th January. See the preceding posting on http://www.worldreports.org for details.

    03 January: An associate of AmeriTrust Groupe Inc., is informed by a Chinese Representative that the $4.5 trillion of Wanta Settlement funds will be distributed via Deutsche Bank, in Germany, shortly, and that the Chinese will officially contact Ambassador Wanta or Mr Cottrell regarding the transfer. Precise details of how this was to be ‘fixed’ are as follows:


    Thus the money-laundering route is known, the objective being to ‘keep everyone happy’.

    03 January: Investigators inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that Vice President Cheney personally ordered Mr McCurdy, a senior Federal Reserve officer in New York, to stop any payment to AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., et al, and to blame the situation on one or more of the investigators (as previously reported on http://www.worldreports.org).

    03 January: Open news reports surface that John Negroponte has abruptly resigned as the Director of National Intelligence. Associates and investigators for AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. inform the Ambassador and Michael C. Cottrell, M.S. that Vice President Richard Cheney and others had compelled Mr Negroponte to resign in order to forestall the implementation of the Presidential Executive Order/Memorandum dated 5th May 2005: see http://www.worldreports ARCHIVE report dated Wednesday 02 August 2006. 11/42 a.m., giving the outline details:

    MEMORANDUM PUBLISHED IN THE FEDERAL REGISTER: ‘Assignment of functions relating to granting of authority for issuance of certain Directives: Memorandum for the Director of National Intelligence: I hereby assign to you the function of the President under Section 13(b)(3)(A) of the Securities Exchange Act of 1934, as amended’.

    The relevance of the above should be evident without the need for further explanation here.

    04 January: Associates of AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. inform Michael C. Cottrell, M.S. that a senior official within the Bush Administration with his office located within the White House compound, advises that Mr Paulson, the disgraced US Treasury Secretary, has flown to Israel, and that he departed “shortly after the Rose Garden speech of President Bush” in order to avoid any complications “when Chancellor Angela Merkel meets with President Bush” as was scheduled for 4th January.

    04 January: Investigators inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that Vice President Cheney personally telephoned the Vatican and ‘ordered’ that no payments are to be released and/or paid, especially to Ambassador Leo Wanta/ AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. (as previously reported).

    04 January: Associates inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. from sources within the White House compound that:

    (A) “1500 farm packages with black and blue plastic debit cards connected to active payment accounts” have been delivered today to certain recipients.
    (B) Certain members of the United States Department of the Treasury and the United States Department of Defense have “DUAL CITIZENSHIP” of the United States of America and the State of Israel, including the Secretary of the Treasury, Henry M. Paulson Jr.

    It is illegal for the holder of an office under the United States to hold dual citizenship and more than one passport. Allegiance to the United States of America can only be pledged by a holder of a single passport, namely one issued by the US Department of State.

    The American people will rightly be scandalised and furious at this state of affairs.

    Note: Both the United States and Britain need to take immediate and urgent action to eliminate from their structures all who have allegiances to foreign powers and intelligence services. Otherwise there is no point in the continued existence of the national intelligence services themselves.

    04 January: Associates inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that US Vice President Cheney is moving funds via Haliburton accounts to various banks in Israel, to be collected by Bank Leumi.

    06 January: Associates inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that the Vatican is a major shareholder of the naked shorted stock “CMKX” and that there are parallel activities relating to AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc.’s efforts regarding the release of the diverted, delayed and stolen $4.5 trillion Settlement and “CMKX” stock valuation and payment.

    07 January: Associates and investigators inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that the White House is in disarray (with people leaving, trying to leave and/or obtaining legal counsel against the hurricane to come). This disarray is directly related to our reports about Scam Meister Paulson having been arrested, publication of the letters submitted to President George W. Bush and Vice President Richard Cheney subject of the preceding posting, and innumerable enquiries concerning the whereabouts of the US Treasury Secretary.

    07 January: Chinese representatives inform associates of AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that Chinese officials have suddenly aborted all question of contacting Ambassador Leo E. Wanta and/or Michael C. Cottrell, M.S. [see above].

    07 January: Another authoritative source in the United States surfaces and verifies to an associate of AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that Mr Henry M. Paulson was indeed arrested in Germany in December 2006. This information was reconfirmed from a knowledgeable source in Chicago.

    While such further ‘verification’ is in fact unnecessary, it is appropriate to add this here, given the firestorm triggered by our original report about Paulson’s arrest – the point being that this fact was being independently verified by others from reliable sources inside the US financial community.

    08 January: Investigators inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that key “players” in the West Wing of the White House have appointed lawyers and that a number of Case Numbers have been assigned. This provides a further indication of disarray prevailing in the Bush II White House – as a direct consequence of the criminal financial corruption scams and thefts perpetrated to date, and their exposure via this website. At least one Case Number has also been assigned for an operative who has been distributing diversionary disinformation and libelling the Editor of International Currency Review. Measures are also being taken behind the scenes to address this self-incriminating ‘Black Ops’ behaviour, which has revealed dimensions of the corruption that the criminal cadres had thought would never ‘come out’.

    08 January: The following information about THE NEW WORLD ORDER is aired on LOU DOBBS REPORTS (CNN). It refers to a subversive CIA OMEGA operation. Specifically, Bill Tucker exposes capsule information on Robert Zoelnick and the Association of American Free Trade Agreement, which would enable PRIVATE ORGANISATIONS in the United States, Canada, Mexico and Latin America to create a Common Market, enabling a small elite group of corporations to smother and supersede the sovereignty of each country in the Americas. As an aside, Bill Tucker points out that over the past five years, US corporations have increased their profits by 45%, while the workers’ earnings have risen by 5%. For the first time, the Fascist (Nazi) corporate control blueprint surfaces into the mass media and the public domain.

    09 January: Associates and investigators inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that officials testifying before the “Ad Hoc Tribunal” on 23rd December 2006, which we can now reveal took place in Frankfurt, Germany, were informed that an investigation by the German Bundes Nachrichten Dienst (BND, overt German secret service) had revealed (confirming our report to that effect):

    • That Henry M. Paulson was attempting to use Ambassador Wanta’s $4.5 trillion of private funds (tagged with the beneficial ownership of Ambassador Leo E. Wanta/Lee E. Wanta and AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc.) without permission or authority, since early December 2006 (as stated in the warrant issued against Treasury Secretary Paulson by the International Court Of Justice (ICJ), which was acted upon in Germany and was the subject of the Frankfurt “Ad Hoc Tribunal”). Paulson was doing this earlier, but the warrant mentioned the timeframe cited here.

    • That Henry M. Paulson lied to the Chinese Elders and to the Chinese Government officials during his official visit to Peking on 13th-15th December 2006, when he stated that he would release the $4.5 trillion Settlement funds to Ambassador Leo E. Wanta and AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc.:

    • By countermanding Federal Reserve Chairman Dr Ben Bernanke’s approval for the release of the $4.5 trillion on 15th December 2006, and halting all payment processes.

    • That Mr Henry M. ‘Conflict-of-Interest’ Paulson, upon arrest, presented a Diplomatic Passport (which, he had been advised, provided him with immunity from arrest). HOWEVER THIS PAULSON DIPLOMATIC PASSPORT WAS NOT, REPEAT NOT, CONFIRMED BY THE U.S. CONSULATE, and it was therefore held for testimony in connection with Mr Paulson’s activities relating to the non-payment, diversion, manipulation and de facto theft of the private funds belonging to Ambassador Leo E Wanta with Goldman Sachs and Company, a co-conspirator (Citibank, C.H.I.P.S.) account, and the funds located with RABO Bank in Germany for the benefit of Ambassador Leo E. Wanta, AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., and through them, the American people, who are being defrauded by these criminals.

    • That the Frankfurt Tribunal ordered Paulson to ‘work with’ the Chinese to fulfil the payment to Ambassador Wanta and AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., and:

    • That he was released to the custody of the British authorities for transportation on a British aircraft back to the United States on 1st January 2007, as reported above.

    09 January: Investigators inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that the $4.5 trillion US dollars held in the Goldman Sachs C.H.I.P.S. account has been UNLAWFULLY REMOVED and that the funds have been UNLAWFULLY TRANSFERRED to the therefore co-conspiring BANK OF NEW YORK (NYC) on Christmas Day, 25th December 2006, while nobody was supposedly watching. This transfer clearly implicates James R. Wilkinson, Chief of Staff at the US Treasury, as an accomplice to the movement and theft of Wanta’s private $4.5 trillion agreed upon Settlement funds, making Wilkinson, like Paulson, Goldman Sachs, Citibank, Bank of New York, Wachovia Bank, Vice President Richard Cheney, and the President of the United States and others, including allegedly the Bank of England, vulnerable to legal action for organised criminal operations (especially R.I.C.O.).

    09 January: Thomas E. Henry Esq. issues a letter to James R Wilkinson, Chief of Staff, United States Treasury, referencing again the “apparent circumvention and avoidance of agreed upon financial settlement regarding Leo E. Wanta/Lee E. Wanta and AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc.”. A facsimile of the original letter is appended as an attachment to the email version of this posting. In this letter, Mr Henry correctly repeats the warnings concerning breaches of critical legislation that have long since been displayed in successive postings on http://www.worldreports.org, and which the recipients of Mr Henry’s letters have chosen to overlook, doubtless believing that the Rule of Law does not apply to them, as it applies to the rest of us. The text of this new letter reads as follows:

    Thomas E. Henry, Attorney at Law, 1125 South 79th Street, Omaha, Nebraska 68124

    January 9, 2007

    Mr James R. Wilkinson
    Chief of Staff
    United States Department of the Treasury
    1500 Pennsylvania Avenue
    Washington DC 20220

    Via Facsimile: 202-622 6464 and 202-622 0073

    Re: Apparent Circumvention and Avoidance of Agreed Upon Financial Settlement regarding Leo E. Wanta/Lee E. Wanta and AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc:

    Dear Mr Wilkinson

    I anticipate that you are aware that several letters have been sent to the Office of the President and Vice President of the United States of America, Secretary Paulson, United States Department of the Treasury, Ambassador Negroponte, pertinent USG agencies, the United States Congress and other foreign and domestic concerned parties expressing concern and dismay at the failure of relevant parties to follow the “Rule of Law” in regard to the referenced matter.

    It has been brought to our attention that you are either knowingly and/or unwittingly aiding and abetting in thwarting the completion and satisfaction of agreed upon terms and conditions for the referenced settlement. To assist in your understanding of the seriousness of this matter and to minimize the repetitiveness of earlier communications I am attaching previous select letters sent to elected and Senate confirmed parties.

    The specific purpose of this letter is to confirm notification to you in writing that failure to comply with terms and conditions of the agreed upon settlement constitutes a violation of the Securities Acts of 1933, 1934 and of the Organized Crime Control Act of 1970, specifically R.I.C.O. Additionally, you are advised of H.R. 3723 that summarily provides that corporate business activity is protected under the Economic and Industrial Espionage Laws of the United States of America and the International Economic Community.

    All concerned parties are aware that Secretary Paulson, under his personal signature, has control over referenced settlement agreement funds located at Goldman Sachs, et al. (C.H.I.P.S.) account with CITIBANK, NYC. It is believed that Secretary Paulson, in violation of his oath of office when accepting a position in your Cabinet with responsibility to the United States Department of the Treasury, is avoiding his legal and ethical obligations to complete the transfer of the referenced settlement agreement funds and apparently favoring a private business relationship with his previous employer. This conflict of interest position and Secretary Paulson’s former relationship with Goldman Sachs provides the formidable basis for the assertion of a violation of the Securities Acts and Organized Crime Control Act of 1970. It has now been confirmed that after being advised of the concern with Goldman Sachs, settlement monies have been transferred without legal authorization to alternate financial institutions. The only logical conclusion that can be drawn is that such maneuvers are only completed to forestall and attempt to circumvent the real intent of the parties trying to quash this settlement.

    This matter requires your immediate intervention and direction to enable mitigation of a very volatile situation with the potential of serious impact on the global economy. The principals in this matter continually affirm their allegiance to the United States of America and specifically the office of the President of the United States.

    Sincerely yours

    Signed: Thomas E. Henry

    President George W. Bush
    Vice President Cheney
    Ambassador Negroponte
    Appropriate leaders of USG Agencies
    Foreign and domestic concerned parties
    Members of the United States Congress
    Land Baron/Xeno

    P. S. The “Agency” has approved these financial transactions, as noted previously.

    09 January: Associates, investigators and Attorneys associated with AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc./Ambassador Leo E. Wanta and Michael C. Cottrell, M.S., inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that Vice President Cheney is planning to resign on or before 27th January and is negotiating with the Department of Justice for the non-prosecution of Haliburton for multiple double payments received via Vice President Cheney relating to the disastrous prosecution of the Iraq War.

    09 January: Pope Benedict XVI accepts the resignation of the Reverend Janusz Bielanski minutes before his installation as Archbishop of Warsaw. For public consumption (only) the rationale given for this resignation is that Bielanski was an informer for the Communist secret police.

    09 January: THE GREATEST TREASON EVER PERPETRATED AGAINST THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA BY CURRENT HOLDERS OF THE HIGHEST OFFICES, IS NOW IDENTIFIED. For convenience, we break our account of this treason down into numbered sub-paragraphs:

    1. The disgraced US Treasury Secretary, Henry M. ‘Conflict-of-Interest’ Paulson, has been meeting with Chinese officials – primarily the Chinese Minister of Finance, Madame Wu, and certain “Elders” – since leaving the United States in a hurry on 2nd January [see above].
    2. Mr Paulson has persuaded Madame Wu to ‘allow’ him to continue using the $4.5 trillion private US dollar funds held in fiduciary account for Ambassador Leo E. Wanta/ AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., for the purpose of continuing to ‘FILL IN THE HOLES’ in accounts associated with earlier illegal financial transactions, and for making payments to other parties – CONTRARY TO THE “AD HOC TRIBUNAL” ORDER AND OF COURSE CONTRARY TO U.S. LAW (e.g. R.I.C.O.).
    3. The disgraced U.S. Treasury Secretary continues (at this time) to avoid re-arrest in the context of his arrogant and blatant non-compliance with the order of the “Ad Hoc Tribunal’, by flying from city to city on an unpublished flight schedule. In other words, the Secretary of the US Treasury is ‘on the run’, flying around the world seeking a way out of the black hole he has dug for himself and the United States.
    4. Mr Paulson, Vice President Richard Cheney and President George W. Bush still demand that the US Secret Service does not permit the ‘November 17th Data Burst details’ to be released to AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc., for verification of where the $4.5 trillion private Wanta Settlement funds were diverted by Secretary Paulson. If the transaction had been bona fide there would of course be no problem with the release of these data [see our earlier relevant postings]. It was not bona fide.
    5. The process of officially condoned and perpetrated ransacking and theft continues apace, notwithstanding the reality that the disgraced US Treasury Secretary Paulson is very much aware that, with effect from 15th or 16th January, major European Central Banks may begin to drive the US dollar into the ground.

    10 January: Associates inform AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc. that President George W. Bush is in the process of re-writing Regulations/Statute amendments affecting the Federal bankruptcy (foreclosure and seizure) process.

    This relates to the intended re-rating of 40+ million prime and sub-prime mortgages that will occur in the fourth quarter of 2007.

    The conspiracy here devolves as follows:

    When the Federal Reserve (or its successor: see preceding reports) raises US interest rates, against the background of payment of the $4.5 trillion of diverted private funds to AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc….

    … President George W. Bush will be in a position (as intended) to turn round and blame Ambassador Leo E. Wanta and AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc for bringing about a situation compelling the release of the stolen $4.5 trillion in US dollar funds, thereby assisting the appreciation (following its earlier steep devaluation) of the US dollar.

    This is the low calibre of the madness that infects the sick minds of the criminal operatives, who are individually and collectively reported to be ‘terrified’ of the consequences of these exposures of their criminal behaviour.

    • Either there will be no currency with which to make the payment, given that the US dollar has been reduced to limited value thanks to the antics of the disgraced US Treasury Secretary and the Central Banks that have needed to protect their positions by dumping their US dollar holdings (see above)…

    • OR the US economy begins to recover and the Federal Reserve (Central Bank)/US Treasury alleges the existence of inflationary pressures arising from the devaluation and the vast overhang of ‘funny money’, and raises US interest rates, thereby causing the re-rating of the real estate mortgages, in a near-precise replay of the scam which triggered the 1929 depression:

    • ENDING IN A SEVERE DEPRESSION ACCOMPANIED BY HYPERINFLATION, as predicted in the ‘worst-case scenario’ segment of our posted report dated 2nd September 2006 [see ARCHIVE on the Home Page]: a.k.a. ‘THE MORTGAGE WEAPON’.

    Activation of ‘the mortgage weapon’ is a recipe for a social revolution, which can now be clearly seen to be the objective of this revolutionary criminal clique.

    If the criminal operatives holding power wish to trigger a social upheaval in the United States, they have carefully prepared the ground for such an outcome. We are dealing here with true representatives of the Darkness. How best can these operatives hide their criminality? Answer: in an environment of pitch black chaos. And chaos is already present at the White House.

    11 January: Dr Ben Bernanke, Chairman of the Federal Reserve Board, has not been seen in public for many days. On 5th January, Martin Crutsinger, an economics writer with Associated Press (AP), reported that the Federal Reserve Chairman had made a short speech about bank regulation at the Annual Meetings of the Allied Social Science Association in Chicago.

    This is hardly the kind of venue at which Federal Reserve Chairmen are wont to appear (in the Editor’s 37 years of experience of Fed-watching). An investigation by an impeccable US source produced the following finding: ‘Allied Social Science Association is a Marxist brainwashing event, and they probably threw in a few astrology meetings or séances on where the market is going’. On 11th January, pictures appeared of other Governors of the Federal Reserve appearing at this odd event, but at no stage of the proceedings was there any reference to, or picture of, Bernanke addressing it. Two intelligence sources advise that it has been known for conferences to be staged simply in order to send a false message concerning the existence or whereabouts of parties engaged in subterfuges of some kind or other. For Federal Reserve Governors to cluster at such an event is eccentric in the extreme, and the likelihood is that they converged there in order for the media to be able to signal their presence – the underlying purpose being to obfuscate the whereabouts of Dr Bernanke, a co-conspirator and accessory to the fact of the diversion, manipulation and theft of the Wanta Settlement funds.

    In the near future, according to sources, there will be a change of personnel in the White House, noch einmal. This will enable the new officials to reiterate that they know nothing about any of these matters, as there are no records. The technique is well-honed in all bureaucracies, but it is a particular speciality, it seems, of the White House and of the Capitol Hill offices of Senators. In these offices, staffers do the work that the Senators were elected for, and the Senators do what they are told by their staffers. However a Senator (let alone a Representative) is not entitled to delegate any of his powers to anyone. He is elected by the American people, who are the controllers and owners of all levels of American Government, not the other way round.

    What has happened is that the power and sovereignty of the American people has been usurped and stolen by criminal gangs and the criminalised US intelligence services, which are deeply and fatally penetrated by foreign intelligence cadres. The intelligence services control all expressions of the Federal Government, by ensuring that their controlled operatives occupy the highest and most influential positions, after the blueprint for the modern format of the Illuminati as exposed by Professor John Robison of Edinburgh University, in his ‘Proofs of a Conspiracy’, 1798. This control model, elaborated by Professor Adam Weishaupt of Ingolstadt University, is based upon the espionage system developed by Ignatius Loyola and used for centuries by the Jesuits, by whom Weishaupt, a renegade Professor of Canon Law, was educated. These deep dimensions of the global crisis are developed and definitively exposed in the Editor’s study, ‘The New Underworld Order’ [see: intelligence books published by Edward Harle Limited].

    Through the application of this control model, the democratic system is manipulated in accordance with simple revolutionary dialectical principles. It is neither here nor there who wins an election, because the intelligence services always win. The intelligence community needs to be purged, severely dealt with, and crammed back into its box.

    Like these postings, the Editor’s new book is concerned exclusively with exposure of the truth, and shining light into the habitations of the Workers of Darkness.

    The perpetrators of these frauds against the American people, being cornered, appear to believe that they can prevail. The view of Ambassador Wanta, Michael C. Cottrell, M.S. and the Editor of International Currency Review, associates and supporters worldwide, is that they will not prevail.

    It would help if Gold Badges in the United States would do their urgent duty and stop worrying about their pensions: no doubt alternative arrangements can be made later.

    There may also be elements of the US military that must now also look to their primary duty and responsibilities, given that holders of the highest offices are in blatant and egregious breach of their solemn oaths of office.

    If such forces have qualms, they should reconsider, and should place the interests of the American people and the Rest of the World first.

    Otherwise, as we have predicted, there will be a global calamity: and it will have been brought about exclusively as a consequence of the serial criminality of the operatives that have hijacked US governance, only some of whom have so far been identified in successive postings in this series.

    George Orwell: ‘In an age of deceit, speaking the truth is a revolutionary act’.

    J. Edgar Hoover: ‘The individual is handicapped coming face to face with a conspiracy so monstrous, he cannot believe it exists’.
    [As with the Holocaust].

    Martin Luther King: ‘Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere’.

    US friend: ‘You are to be congratulated on a masterful piece of research in exposing the treason and the biggest heist in history’.

    Ambassador Leo Emil Wanta: Diplomatic Passport Numbers 04362 & 12535 a.k.a. Frank B. Ingram [FBI] (Sector V) SA32NV; and a.k.a. Rick Reynolds, SA233MS. AmeriTrust Groupe, Inc: Federal EIN Number 20-3866855; Virginia State Corporation Identification Number: 0617454-4; Virginia State Department of Taxation Identification Number: 30203866855F001

  263. larry January 11, 2007 9:16 pm

    zepher i get your stuff..it is good…kia..same also…. in 236…regarding monotheistic religeons…bam….seems like religion is a soldiers worst nightmare…it is absolutely exhauting trying to work and also track the politicians moves who are enslaving us,,,,,i just don’t have any answers…we need some form of governance,but just not the one’s we actually end up with….at times i can barely keep peace amoung people in my regular average office….conflict is so pervasive….conflict only exceeds inequality of opportunity and all the rest…it is just so unfair in the world….our systems seem to amplify the inequalities rather than dampan them…people are basically angry and know that the systems are destroying them…destroyers are running the joint…that is what i see every day…people paying to be destroyed..paying for mortgages to enslave them…paying for educations that leave them unprepared…paying for medical care that leaves them less healthy…paying for government that pilfers their families future…i mean man…give me some help here…a gordian knot looks simple next to these webs we have weaved…’the times they have changed’,that is true…the scale of destruction that the destroyers may reap is growing and individual powers are shrinking….the formula looks bleak…i just saw three cases of cancer today …all terminal in my opinion…all where preventable with basic lifestyle change implimented decades ago…no money in teaching people how to maintain health…now the system will make about 250k off of treating these folks to sx and chemo and radiation and the people will never feel well again even if they survive…i go to jail if i recomend an alternative therapy…these folks were not aware enough for me to plant the thought of exploring other approaches..they want modern medicine and feel cheated if they dont get it…they have no awarenes that a doctor 30 years ago should have seen but cannot due to the training that they were setting up for degenerative decline…the martix wins everyday from were i sit…eveyday …..be ommissions of truth and substitutions of lies…done with earnest forthright arogance and efficiency…..so modern so cold so lucrative

  264. PB45 January 11, 2007 9:34 pm

    Hey Posters,
    This little article about our ex Homeland Secturity chief (whose security are they talking about theirs or us citizens?). Nice fellow, just the kind to use those new detention facilities sprouting up in the US of A. All the new crowd control devices I listed (especially the ones tested in Lebanon dubbed”Cheney’s) RayGun” should really helpful against a pissed off subprime export jobbed middle class dude with 3 children!

    Negroponte and the escalation of death
    By Dahr Jamail

    As part of a massive staff shakeup of US President George W Bush’s Iraq team last week, it was announced that John Negroponte, the current national intelligence director who also conveniently served as the ambassador to Iraq from June 2004 to April 2005, is being tapped as the new deputy secretary of state.

    It is a move taking place at roughly the same time when Bush is to announce his new strategy for Iraq, which most expect entails an escalation of as many as 20,000 troops, if not more. Bush has

    already begun preparations to replace ranking military commanders with those who will be more supportive of his escalation.

    The top US commander in the Middle East, General John Abizaid, will likely be replaced by Admiral William Fallon, currently the top US commander in the Pacific. General George Casey, currently the chief general in Iraq, will be replaced by army Lieutenant-General David Petraeus, who headed the failed effort to train Iraqi security forces. Thus those not in favor of adding more fuel to the raging fire are to be replaced with those who are happy to oblige.

    The former National Security Agency director and veteran of more than 25 years in intelligence, retired Vice Admiral Mike McConnell, who happens to be an old friend of Vice President Dick Cheney (who personally intervened on his old buddy’s behalf), will succeed Negroponte as national intelligence director. McConnell, willing to oblige his neo-con pal Cheney, may prove more hawkish regarding Iran than Negroponte was.

    The timing of this move is what should raise eyebrows, and for two main reasons. First, Negroponte is relieved of his job of intelligence director as the drums of war continue to be pounded by the diehard neo-conservatives, and Negroponte wasn’t playing quite loud enough to the Tehran tune. McConnell may well be able to carry a louder tune for his pal Cheney, which may come in the form of a sonata of manufactured intelligence to justify an attack on Iran, which is important as time is growing short for Cheney and company.

    Second and more immediate, the transfer of Negroponte into the State Department comes conveniently just as the announcement of the escalation of troops in Iraq is planned. Bush needs someone with experience in managing escalations and he needs look no further than this man. It is Negroponte who oversaw the implementation of the “Salvador Option” in Iraq, as it was referred to in Newsweek in January 2005.

    Under the “Salvador Option”, Negroponte had assistance from his colleague from his days in Central America during the 1980s, retired Colonel James Steele. Steel, whose title in Baghdad was counselor for Iraqi security forces, supervised the selection and training of members of the Badr Organization and Mehdi Army, the two largest Shi’ite militias in Iraq, to target the leadership and support networks of a primarily Sunni resistance.

    Planned or not, these death squads promptly spiraled out of control to become the leading cause of death in Iraq. Intentional or not, the scores of tortured, mutilated bodies that turn up on the streets of Baghdad each day are generated by the death squads whose impetus was Negroponte. And it is this US-backed sectarian violence that largely led to the hell-disaster that Iraq is today.

    Under president Ronald Reagan in the early 1980s, Negroponte was the US ambassador to Honduras, where he played a major role in US efforts to topple the Nicaraguan government. The political history of Negroponte shows a man who has had a career bent toward generating civilian death and widespread human-rights abuses, and promoting sectarian and ethnic violence.

    In Honduras he earned the distinction of being accused of widespread human-rights violations by the Honduras Commission on Human Rights while he worked as “a tough Cold Warrior who enthusiastically carried out president Ronald Reagan’s strategy”, according to cables sent between Negroponte and Washington during his tenure there. The human-rights violations carried out by Negroponte were described as “systematic”.

    The violations Negroponte oversaw in Honduras were carried out by operatives trained by the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA). Records document his “special intelligence units”, better known as “death squads”, composed of CIA-trained Honduran armed units who kidnapped, tortured and killed hundreds of people. Negroponte had full knowledge of these activities while making sure US military aid to Honduras increased from US$4 million to $77.4 million a year during his tenure. Under his watch, civilian deaths skyrocketed into the tens of thousands.

    Negroponte has been described as an “old-fashioned imperialist” and got his start during the Vietnam War in the CIA’s Phoenix Program, which was responsible for the assassination of some 40,000 Vietnamese.

    At roughly that time, Steele was commander of the US Military Adviser Group in El Salvador. He also smuggled weapons to the Contra insurgents in Nicaragua and lied about it to the Senate Intelligence Committee, as documented in the final report of the Iran-Contra special prosecutor.

    As a result of the work done by Negroponte, assisted by Steele, during the winter of 2004 and early spring 2005, daily life in Iraq, as described by the Washington Post, looks like what the death squads generated in Central America under their watchful eyes: “Hundreds of unclaimed dead lay at the morgue at midday Monday - blood-caked men who had been shot, knifed, garroted or apparently suffocated by the plastic bags still over their heads. Many of the bodies were sprawled with their hands still bound.”

    Obviously it is better for Iraqi militias and resistance groups to be fighting one another instead of uniting to battle occupation forces. The age-old strategy of divide and conquer applied yet again.

    Negroponte’s strategy and oversight of the dirty war in Honduras assisted in producing a “victory” there, but it has failed dismally in Iraq. Nevertheless, when one has an administration that refuses to accept reality, bringing him back into the fold of the State Department may be a signal that it is willing to see much more blood seep into the sands of Iraq in the hope that it will produce something akin to stability.

    Negroponte’s appointment signals that Bush hopes to tap into his experiences from the medium-intensity war in Central America to do the same once again in Iraq. Coupled with the changes in the military and diplomatic team in Iraq, it is a clear signal that the US administration is ready, willing and able to head down the course of massive and indiscriminate escalation. It must be stopped.

    Dahr Jamail has reported from inside Iraq and is a Middle East expert. He writes for Asia Times Online and Inter Press Service and is a contributor to Foreign Policy In Focus.

    (Posted with permission from Foreign Policy in Focus)

    We are also blessed for a new yet reclusive “new hawkish Iraq adviser” Read:./Peter

    The superhawk behind the surge
    By Jim Lobe

    WASHINGTON - When President George W Bush unveils his long-awaited new strategy on Iraq on Wednesday night eastern US time, he will be relying heavily on the counsel of one J D Crouch II, perhaps the most hardline - if most obscure - of his hawkish advisers.

    Over the past 15 years, the generally low-profile Crouch has taken any number of controversial positions, from advocating military action against Cuba and North Korea to blaming the 1999 Columbine High School student massacre in Colorado on “30

    years of liberal social policy”.

    As deputy national security adviser, Crouch, who has held three posts in the Bush administration, chaired the inter-agency group charged with mapping out Bush’s new Iraq strategy, whose main feature, it is expected, will be to add some 20,000 new US troops to the 140,000 already there in hopes of stabilizing Baghdad and rebellious al-Anbar province.

    Crouch, whose substantive expertise is in arms control - or, more precisely, how the US can evade or undermine international efforts to promote arms control - has long been a favorite of Vice President Dick Cheney, whose own national security adviser, neo-conservative John Hannah, has reportedly played a key role in the deliberations over Iraq.

    Crouch first worked under Cheney at the Pentagon during the administration of president George H W Bush when, as a deputy assistant secretary for international security, he contributed to the controversial 1992 draft Defense Policy Guidance (DPG) that, among other things, called on Washington to pursue unquestioned military dominance in and around Eurasia.

    He returned to the Pentagon as assistant secretary for international security after President George W Bush’s election in 2001. In that capacity, he focused mostly on the current administration’s withdrawal from the 1972 Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty, its plans to develop new kinds of nuclear weapons, and the preparation of the 2002 National Security Strategy, which codified many of the ideas first proposed in the 1992 DPG, rather than on Washington’s military campaigns in Afghanistan and Iraq.

    He left the administration in late 2003 to return to Southwest Missouri State University (SMSU), long a stronghold of missile-defense, nuclear-arms and space-weapons advocates, only to be appointed the following year as ambassador to Romania, a post he held for just eight months before being recalled to Washington in early 2005 as deputy national security adviser under Stephen Hadley.

    His return was described by Washington Post columnist Jim Hoagland as evidence that Cheney was “charging ahead with undiminished influence and unshakable self-confidence”.

    Now 48, Crouch first entered government after earning a doctorate in international relations at the University of Southern California in the mid-1980s. With the help of his longtime mentor and one of then-president Ronald Reagan’s most hawkish advisers, William Van Cleave, Crouch was assigned to the State Department’s Arms Control and Disarmament Agency before joining the staff of the far-right senator from Cheney’s home state of Wyoming, Malcolm Wallop, in 1986.

    He moved in 1990 to the Pentagon, where he worked under then-under secretary of defense for policy Paul Wolfowitz. After the first Gulf War he was part of a team that included Wolfowitz; Cheney’s future vice-presidential chief of staff until 2005, I Lewis Libby; and Washington’s current ambassador to Iraq, Zalmay Khalilzad, and that prepared the draft DPG. Its leak to the New York Times sparked a major controversy that eventually prompted the Bush Sr administration to repudiate its more unilateralist proposals.

    Crouch spent most of the 1990s teaching at SMSU, whose department of defense and strategic studies was headed by Van Cleave, and speaking out against what he and his associates charged was the “appeasement” policies of the Bill Clinton administration.

    He strongly denounced US-North Korean negotiations in 1995, for example, calling for Washington to send more troops and deploy tactical nuclear weapons to South Korea to carry out air strikes against nuclear targets in North Korea if Pyongyang refused to give up its nuclear program at the time.

    The following year, he criticized Clinton for imposing travel restrictions and economic sanctions against Cuba after its air force shot down two civilian planes flown by anti-Fidel Castro activists from south Florida. “We ought to have considered military options,” he said at the time. “As long as we allow a totalitarian communist regime to exist 90 miles from our borders, we can expect these kinds of problems to recur.”

    He also joined the board of advisers of the ultra-hawkish Center for Security Policy, a lobby group funded by defense contractors and far-right Zionists associated with Israel’s Likud Party and headed by hardline neo-conservative Frank Gaffney.

    Other members of that board have included senior members of the current US administration, including Elliot Abrams, the senior Middle East director on the National Security Council; former Defense Policy Board chairman Richard Perle; former under secretary of defense for policy Douglas Feith; and a number of former and current SMSU faculty members, including Van Cleave, Charles Kupperman, Keith Payne, and the former head of Reagan’s Star Wars program, Henry Cooper.

    From his perch at SMSU, meanwhile, Crouch also spoke out and wrote on domestic issues, taking classically far-right positions against big government, progressive taxation and gun control.

    In a letter published in the Washington Times, he blamed the shooting rampage by two teenage students of 12 of their classmates and one teacher on “30 years of liberal social policy that has put our children in daycare, taken God out of the schools, taken Mom out of the house and banished Dad as an authority figure from the family altogether”. He has since insisted that he does not oppose “women in the workplace”.

    Although such positions generally do not reflect neo-conservative views, neo-cons, including Perle and Gaffney, have, like Cheney, been among Crouch’s most enthusiastic boosters over the years.

    “Knowing him as I do,” Gaffney, whose list of US adversaries against which Washington should be much more confrontational runs from Iran, North Korea, Syria and Venezuela to China, Russia and France, told the St Louis Post Dispatch, “I’m almost certain that he is exercising influence, and influence that is reinforcing the most robust policies and positions of this administration.”

    (Inter Press Service)

  265. Dr Jane Karlsson January 12, 2007 5:31 am

    bp #259: actually I suspect there is more to this than just the media getting things wrong. Lots of people think they have ‘alien genes’. In many cases, it was the US military who told them that. Here is an account from such a person: http://www.aboveblack.com/ebook/9.html

  266. zephyr January 12, 2007 5:54 am

    Kia, I don’t know why your post took so long at 236. Anyway, as almost always, I agree with what you say but the belief/idea thing is just semantics….splitting hairs. Beliefs are fine if they are open-minded and welcoming while ideas can also be bad and dangerous. It’s basically the same thing just different words. If it makes you feel better all the aforementioned by me are my ideas ;-)

  267. Kia January 12, 2007 7:33 am

    Larry (#263) Our only recourse at this point is to “don’t buy it.” It deprives them of the money.

    Zephyr (#266) Sometimes it takes me a while to craft a post worthy posting (assuming anything I write measures up.) I only wish that everyone’s belief’s were as flexible are yours. ;-)

    I’m still not sure what the difference between belief and faith is.

    Faith is believing what you know ain’t so - Mark Twain

  268. Makia January 12, 2007 7:36 am


    . . . :-(.

    I know, i know.

  269. kia January 12, 2007 11:14 am

    Rich (#247,248),

    Here’s the latest on the NSA and Microsoft’s Vista OS


    Your world, delivered to Big Brother.


  270. Makia January 12, 2007 2:15 pm

    zephyr, the light breeze:

    I am baffled as to how anyone without a lobotomy could even partially support our political elite. Their agenda is becoming so obvious.

    How long have you been baffled? I seriously don’t get it either. I just say, “I’d rather know and not be able to do anything about it than be ignorant.” I’ve said it before, i’m just waiting and entertaining myself in the meantime.

    I always thought it so stupid to say “I’m against the war but I support the troops.” But the troops are mindlessly carrying out bad orders. Especially if many know in their hearts this whole charade is wrong and they still go out and follow orders. That’s why such young men are sent out to fight. Because they’re pliable, easily controlled and expendable. Words are very cheap….words like honor, duty, “protecting our freedom”, “protecting our way of life”. What is our way of life?

    I read this and thought very much it was worth the repeat. Thank you zephyr. I’ll have to tell y’all sometime how close i was to signing my name on the dotted line (U.S. Army) in March 2003. I took my physical and everything. What a world, what a world.

  271. Makia January 12, 2007 2:50 pm

    Thing is, i was “informed” and “baffled” long before March 2003.

    . . . but my mom was so proud.


  272. larry January 12, 2007 4:09 pm

    makia…checkin in…you are real bright for a young fella…good,i am glad you decided it was not in your best interest to run around as target practice for snipers…we need a draft…that way when enough get slaughtered fighting some some old politicians war making money for his corporate arms dealers friends they can protest….eeeventually,the noise forces a conclusion of hostilities…now adays with private voluntee armies,no one can protest cause they were dumb enough to join up…president has hin self a private army…i think the constiitution warned against this exact circumstance….never fight an other guys private war,let him….doesnt that make common sense….ignore all future false dialectic diatribs about our government needing to fight enemies that threaten us…our government is the enemy and the terrorist…permanent perpetual war makes for a better peace….orwelian

  273. kastor January 12, 2007 4:27 pm

    I haven’t read this much anti-American hoo-ha in quite some time. If any of you whiners are American citizens you should move away from the country if you hate it so damn much. We won’t stop you. perhaps you should all move to Iran where you can feel free to speak your mind, or North Korea. The facts are these: G.W. Bush and his advisors were highly flawed in their technique of waging war but, they were all entirely right in thinking it was high time to try and bring a representative Arab government to the middle east. History will show their ideas were correct but their use of power was wimpy, much like people who continually bash their own country to the point of treason but would wet themselves if they actually had to stand up for it. Support the troops. Support the war. War is a fact of man kind and all of your cry baby, conspiracy alleging whining won’t ever change it. Either shut the hell up or join up, pick up a weapon and join in. Cowards.

  274. Rich January 12, 2007 4:57 pm

    Hey kastor, take some time out to read just how much your leadership (GW Bush family cartel) is doing business with the likes of the Saudi royal family - there are many books on the subject. US troops are dying in Iraq to support an agenda that you and I aren’t even allowed to begin to debate with current leadership, it’s all secret and out of sight. The media doesn’t report it and the people can’t vote on it.

    You appear to be saying that we should all blindly follow the president wherever he leads us because he will always know better and we should be grateful to be his followers?

    I would’ve thought that if you are really such a strong patriot you would support the rights of all American’s to say whatever they feel compelled to say, and that freedom of speech was one of the first things you’d protect - regardless of whether you believed what was being said or not by any citizen.

    You need to face the facts that the majority of American’s now don’t trust or believe in the lying sack of potato’s that is the current leadership. Never before in modern times has a US president been so thoroughly despised by so many American’s and simultaneously by so many people around the rest of the world.

    The fact is that this guy, and his puppet masters, are an absolute liability to all of us. They are war mongering, war profiteers, and if you ever took the time to be rational, to do your own research, and to understand something for yourself (instead of what has been programmed in to your head) - then you might also see the truth for what it is.

    War is totally avoidable and is a consequence of a complete breakdown in civility. War is the domain of cowards, people too scared to face their own delusional reality. Our leaders hide behind war - they aren’t brave souls facing down tyrannical despots with the odds against them - quite the contrary, read the article on Negroponte - - we’re the people that allow our leaders to install despots in to third world nations, to run death squads and to rape the people and the land to support our material lifestyle.

    Now that my friend is cowardice.

    Cheers Rich

    PS. History will be utterly humiliating for the current US regime. In the ashes of what will follow this period in our history will be discovered the truth about who these people are and the damage to humanity they have done. It is a shame that western culture will most likely be remembered, not for its contribution to the arts and sciences, but for the ugly war mongering regimes we were prepared to allow to represent us as a people.

    PPS. Perhaps you would advocate the use of nuclear weapons on the Iranians?

  275. larry January 12, 2007 6:45 pm

    273kastor…have you ever been drafted??..have you ever been told that is in your best interest to charge up that hill and kill the machine gunners?….soldiers are used by polticians . period. war rarely,almost never,low probability,ever cured anything….modern war is a grand scam…it makes bankers and industialists rich…it keeps political lackys at peace with their money masters….it creates more and war…and more money and schemes…the only winers are the real whiners..those war mongers…whine whine whine…war…war…war….money money money…you need to figure it out…the dialectic pits us against foriegn’enemies’and our systems here pits us against one an other….can’t you see the grand masters playing us….their methods get better and bolder and more profitable over time….patriotism is just a symbol…peace is a place that has been taken from our modern lives…pariotism can’t get you peace or we would have it in boatloads…it is not cowardly or unpatriotic to question the powers that are,no,it is your duty…they work for us not we for them….to wage war they require limited thinking highly influenceable alpha males…to call these sorts cowards they know motivates them to die for the bankers that are safe and rich…bankers are bloodletters…you despise your own countrymens opinions when you should despise the leaders and corrupt greed that puts money over people each and every war…that is what i have learned from history and war…name 10 benevolent leaders real fast…now name 10 great warrior leaders or generals ..which is easier..see,,,,war is the greatest adventure…’forgive me, but god i love it’george patton….the goal is not to die over a hollow set of symbols that ascribe meaning for their purposes….the goal is to live free and die in peace…war is not patriotism…war is death destruction and hate..it is more of the same….until people throw out manipulative symbols and agendas other than your own, we are susseptable to being their tools…are you an other mans tool?…is that your goal…a patriotic tool…define patriotism…define terrorist…define war or love….do it…you will see…hate is the door closure and love is the opener….’give peace a chance’,when will that actually occur…not if you value their symbols and conditions…they are outwardly directed and using your physical being to attain their goals and aspirations…how is that knoble for either party…it is pragmatic to the beneficiary and dull and stupid for their patriotic beast..they have no respect for the people that they bend to embrase their hollow symbols…they bend you to their will over a word and use your body as a beast…they exhibit the maximum ultimate contempt possible…they can lie to your face and have you glad to die for them…you will know when the cause for your death is right and not them…only you can know what really matters and not them..and you know this middle east war is about their oil money and power,,,that you know ,,,so put in your pocket and us it for yourself and not them

  276. kastor January 12, 2007 8:57 pm

    Thirty years in uniform,now long retired, and I have charged up that hill. pariotism is more than a symbol. Those who can’t stand up for their own country will appease any power that comes along. America still stands for freedom to think and say what we want. I would stand up for another thirty years to defend your right to speak your mind without the fear of some secret police kicking your door in at midnight and taking you away, simply for opening your mouth. These are the kinds of rights we are attempting to give the Iraqi’s with our blood. History will judge those who wear the uniform and give the orders for this cause as being right, regardless of whether the people in the region drink from the cup of freedom to speak and think freely that we are trying to give to them. What do you suppose the region would have been like in another ten years had we not went into Iraq? If we had gone into Iraq with overwhelming force as we did in gulf war one, and we had been successful in securing Iraq and institutionalizing a representative government there, there would not be so many detractors as there are now. You see, most of you do not really care about the war or who dies in the war in any way, shape or form unless it hits you personnaly. You care about the success or failure of it all. You are just like those who jump on the bandwagon of the winners while flogging the losers even though you may have once been on board with the losers. You don’t really stand for much.

  277. larry January 12, 2007 11:04 pm

    kastor…i would stand up and fight for your right to speak and be free…i did military but no combat…i am saying that the political/industrial machine is not about those reasons…they say they are….they are about the actual benefit…the tangable war booty…war generates profits and collateral damage…they want booty and accept the casualties as a cost of doing buisness…this resolves to bring about more conflict,war and money to the elitist/industrialists….they us good people and bury the trail of pain that generates for the monies they seek..war is the greatest scam!…the first casualty of war is truth…has GWB been honest i think not,,,,,he started the lies that started the war that requires the lies….war is a failure of diplomacy.by choice.diplomacy costs time and money.war takes time,ideally a long time,but produces profits….industrialists prefer war and so after each short rearmament break we get a next war…politicians work for money people and so they therefore work to promote war….war is the biggest buisness next to death care

  278. kastor January 12, 2007 11:45 pm

    It doesn’t matter that there is a military industrial complex that likes to make money, that is neither here nor there in the final analysis. That has always been the way of the world, we wage war and someone is saavy enough to supply the warriors for a profit. It wasn’t Bush who lied to us, he believed what he was saying. The world was ready to get rid of Saadam, everyone believed he had WMD’s going on. It was just another reason to get him out of the picture and try to use the situation to ignite some change in the middle east. We took the initiative, for many reasons,..oil, change, wmd;s,,it doesn’t matter. The opportuntiy to change the middle east and show we were serious enough about it to spill American blood was presented to us on 9-11. Yeah, I know, Iraq had nothing to do with 9-11. Not directly anyway. The same people who now are against America for spilling blood in Iraq are the same ones who said for years that we only had the will to drop smart bombs and cruise missles but no will for ground combat. The middle east has been a powder keg for decades and it is not all because of American policies in the past. Every country who has ever ventured there in the past five hundred years is to blame. The French, the Russians, the British, among the most recent countries who have started numerous problems in the region which the USA somehow is always the go to for clean up. Well, we are there, Iraq was the opportunity to begin a true democratic change in the region and if we blow it, there will never be another chance to bring some western style freedom to those people in the region who yearn for it. They have been ruled by self proclaimed wise men who oppress them for far too long. The hell with the original reasons and the money makers, as long as we have a commander in chief who believes in the light at the end of the tunnel, all else is just extraneous BS. When the commander in chief says jump, we must ask how high. It was imperative that we spill blood in a cause to bring some true freedoms to those people and every American citizen should not only support the war and the troops, they should implore our leaders to pull out all of the stops and do what ever it takes to win, even if it means a draft. They must rally this country into a war posture and make us realize the true stakes at play in this war. Instead of waning support for the troops, every American should be kissing the foreheads of every soldier who returns and tell them Thank You.

  279. Makia January 13, 2007 4:43 am

    kastor, you make these things too simplistic. but perhaps they are. greed. power. money. it motivates everyone around me. i am not one to argue. you’ve laid into the war-questioning folks, so i’ll lay one on you:

    you have a narrow view of spirituality

    that being said, most modern people do. you have a view of spirituality, i admit. love of country, love of freedom. this is not bad and i will not criticize you for it. but beleive it man, if you think this war in iraq was all about wmd and you think that ww2 was all about good people fighting nazis then you are just ignorant to a whole spectrum of information of a few levels. there is so much to be said about the economics of war, that if you are half as intelligent as you seem you are a COMPLETE fool to ignore that it drives many decisions made by the leaders. you can let them deceive us about our money and about our wars and about our government and about social spending, but you have to know you are ignoring a big part of the story. this is not conspiracy theory, is it?

    this society of whiners is what happens when politicians spend a couple of generations buying votes with tax dollars. you don’t know me kastor, and i could give a crap if you call me a whiner. i am not. when i was unemployed i purposely didn’t collect wc. and i’m not gonna sit here and criticize anyone who does. but if you are going to sit on your all-knowing judgement seat and call me a whiner then you do not know me or why i do the things i do, or say the things i say, what is behind my actions.

    kastor, you do understand why i almost enlisted. you’ve articulated my reasons very well in your last couple of posts. but in the end, i made a decision that i make a better father than a target. in the end, i will fight on my own terms and if i am being deceived for the reasons, i will deceive myself before i put myself in the cycle of misinformation that is the fog of war.

    you are right kastor, war is a part of humanity, has been a part of humanity. but what am i to do when i see the misinformation? you can sit there and say that the ends of democracy will/would have justified the means - if only the gov’t will/would have taken the gloves off, but can’t you see that you are beleiving lies just like so many muslims and arabs, and caucasians, the world over? do you feel like the half truths that your leaders feed to their people are somehow of a higher moral caliber to get people to be targets in a mismanaged war that the half truths told by the muslim and arab and french leaders, etc?

    kastor, WAR HAS BEEN PART OF HUMANITY, YES! but so has the powerful and elite, who very often have not worked hard (like i know what it is like to work hard, not that i consider my life so hard, i am an American (read:born an American)) or risked their lives for others, taking advantage of and lying to the populous for their own gain despite the truth of the lies and inequality of the situation. and it is also a part of humanity that the populous rarely does anything about it. who am i to argue? NOBODY. i’m nobody. you know it. i know it. but let me talk my thoughts on an internet thread about the possibility of inner harmony. of consiously “playing the game,” not being blindly led into darkness by people who have everything to lose by my enlightenment and much to gain by my ignorance.

    people are ignorant. the whiners you speak of are ignorant, and so are the blind patriots that you seem so fond of. now get off your fucking high-horse and into the trenches of self-development. its hard fucking work and EVERYONE will disagree with you about something. you will have to face your ego. you will have to face your friends and familiy as you never have before. you will have to look at the leaders of this world and know that your kingdom is TRULY not of this world, and that is just the way it is and the REAL truth that is so hard for almost every human to face.

    then you will have some idea about why i am against war. and you will know the saddness that i carry, willingly. you will know how i feel about my friends and family who are in the middle-east in harms way. you will know how i feel about the strangers of a different color who are getting blown up everyday over there. you will know, or at least be able to appreciate, how i view my role in the world. i appreciate yours, i do. as i am fond of saying in this vein, “we are all in the same boat.” and, “life ain’t easy.” just think about it kastor. you’ve trashed my beleifs without knowing it, without knowing me, and without knowing what is behind my beleifs, but MUCH more importantly, my actions.

    i will fuck an arab up who’s waging war against me for a stupid reason; but shouldn’t i fuck a caucasian up for the same? i will, or go out dancing; sadness and thankfulness and all

    i know what you mean to call some of the people who are against “the war,” whiners. many, many are just that. but you don’t know everyone, and just remember, life ain’t easy and we’re all in this boat together. whether we like it or not. intelligent people have their way of dealing with it. respect mine, or simply die in ignorance.

  280. Makia January 13, 2007 4:54 am

    kastor, if you’re there, perhaps we have some useful things to discuss with eachother. i agree with you on many things, beleive it or not, even if you are a bit biting. i can be, too. sometimes giving people what they need is more that being nice and peachy with them. i understand that; and you do too. if people want everyone else to agree with them and be warm and fuzzy all the time then, well these are many of the real whiners that both of us have a problem with. i gtg. if i’m not talking to a wall kastor, then i wish you well and hope that you do soften up, even just a little.

  281. Dr Jane Karlsson January 13, 2007 6:04 am

    PB45 #262: thanks. Your stuff takes forever to go through, but it’s worth it. I should mention that I don’t have a job or a family, so it’s easier for me than for anyone else here.

    Kastor, welcome back. You are every bit as good at making me feel bad as you were before you left.

    Makia #270: ‘I’d rather know and not be able to do anything about it than be ignorant.’ You cannot imagine how comforting that is to someone who has spent 30 years trying to present facts about the causes of disease to people who would rather not know them.

  282. Makia January 13, 2007 6:19 am

    Dr. Jane, i wish i could share what i know more easily. What i know is the experiential value of so many kinds of balance. Balance is “never” acheived in practice, it is the abstract - but all you need to look at is the opposite concepts: nihilism, absolutism, to know that striving for balance is the healthier pursuit. But i have worked so hard, and indeed needed to kill myself, and become reborn, to acheive the experience. Some know the importance of rebirth, but most of those still see the concept as an end to a journey or an isolated revelation, not the perpetual nature of all existence that it is. I (actually my ego) has gone through the process of death and rebirth so many times that it is second nature now. I forget how hard it is to “overthrow” the ego. And mind anyone here, i am still young and have a lot of dying yet to do, and its not always easy. but the altenative is to beleive (the ego beleives) that it is immortal - despite the obvious - and _clings_ to existence, and often what it perceives as salvation - despite the obvious. Almost all of us here have a lot of dying yet to do, as we all have lives and aren’t on our deathbeds.

    Thank you for your encouragement Jane, and larry. My ego appreciates it. Larry, it hasn’t fit into my thoughts in my posts the last couple of days, but i feel that you know the depths of my sadness more than most. I appreciate your deeper thoughts on issues.

    We are all in the same boat.

  283. Dr Jane Karlsson January 13, 2007 6:44 am

    larry #263: how is your documentary going? You asked for my help with it a while back, but I never heard from you.

    Here is an extract from Health On Your Plate, Janet Pleshette 1985, pp 103-104:

    ‘In the 1920s a young doctor, Robert McCarrison, went to live and work among a tribe of people called the Hunza. These poor peasants live in north-west India, 8,000 feet up in the Himalayas. McCarrison spent seven years among them and served as doctor there to 10,000 people. HE DID NOT SEE A SINGLE CASE OF OUR WESTERN DEGENERATIVE DISEASES DURING ALL THAT TIME; CANCER WAS THEN UNKNOWN TO THE HUNZA.’ (emphasis in original)

    I mention this for two reasons: first, the three cancer patients you saw two days ago, and second, because you told me on an earlier thread that ‘cancer soars on a high-carb diet’. The Hunza ate a high-carb diet.

  284. Rich January 13, 2007 7:32 am

    Good morning kastor.

    Just a quick response for you. Firstly, you are 110% committed to your perspective and possibly nothing on earth is going to change that. In some ways that is a great place to be, so self assured, so confident. However, in my humble opinion, in this instance, it is somewhat delusional.

    I’m from a military family (from the “other” side - the British). I went for 6 years to the British equivalent of the Citadel. I marched to breakfast, lunch and dinner, cleaned latrines each day, we even put our sheets in a line each morning in the dormitory. In short I was programmed to join the military from the age of 11 in an institution that had been refined to program kids to go to war for several hundred years (they were experts at it).

    So I know all about patriotism, war, training, beliefs and discipline (they tried to beat the former in to me on occasion).

    Having been through 6 years of boot camp, without pay, I was savvy enough to realize that war is a scam (per the description so aptly supplied by Marine General Smedley Butler).

    I’d been in Iran for 3 years as the Shah was falling from power, and seen the lies from both sides up close. I’ve seen some of the people and their scars from our torture, as well as Iranians who I’m good friends with today who lost everything to the Mullah’s, including family members executed by the Ayatollah. That sword cuts both ways, we commit crimes in order to secure real estate and resources, our opposition commits crimes to try and push us out of their space and take control of their own resources. The pattern is repeated all over the world, you’d have to be blind to not see that. The big question for us in the west is whether we really want to kill people for their resources in order to support our consumerist lifestyle.

    Wouldn’t consuming less for real peace be a better solution for everyone?

    The US can’t bring democracy to Iraq, that would be impossible. Democracy there implies (and I’ve said several times on this site before) that the Shiites run the country (and they’d choose an Islamic Republic - which is not democratic). This is understood by everyone at the highest level in our government, so please don’t believe the fairy tale that this war is about peace and democracy, it ain’t, never was. (I should correct myself here, IF the US can push the majority of Iraqi Shiites over the border in to Iran then perhaps Iraq can be a democracy under Sunni Wahhabist (Saudi) theocratic monarchy!? - - which, btw, ain’t no democracy either!)

    Finally kastor, I would suggest to you that nearly everyone on this site is grateful and respectful of your service to this country (the military is a critical function in our society, the men and women who serve need our support - but not blind support of our politicians, that’s BS). To most of us here we want the US military to do the bidding of the US people, per the laws of this great land. When the US military is doing the bidding of the people there is harmony. When the US military is, unfortunately, doing the bidding of a criminal cabal that has hi-jacked the American Republic, then we all suffer together.

    God Bless American and God Save the Queen!


    Cheers Rich

  285. Makia January 13, 2007 7:36 am

    kastor, your simplistic outlook is not all bad. I know you are intelligent, thought out, and have drawn your conclusions. I have droqn many of the same conclusions, i have some idea of where you are coming from. But in the bigger picture you may be headed for some serious internal turmoil, or even more sad, cold indifference, should you refuse to see a bigger picture. I have gotten some of my deepest insights from warriors from the ages, not but all of these people realized that the cold hard path you are on is not as fulfilling as seeing the forrest and the trees.

  286. Makia January 13, 2007 7:46 am

    Rich #283: thank you thank you. If that post could be copied and pasted all over the east, the west, the south, and the north. . . Life is about experience, not idealism. Life is about experience, not consumerism.

    And all of these things being said cannot predict the future, but from my place of bliss and non-consumerism, i reiterate the words of a great wise man when i say,

    “We’re all freaking doomed.”

    It our way of life that is doomed, thankfully, not our lives themselves. I hope so anyway. My ego hopes so, i suppose. I am tired of the hollowness. And if the end of “our” way of life brings the end of my life proper, then i welcome it; and i promise i will go out dancin’. This is the way of the true warrior, enlisted in an army of the earth or not. God bless us all.

  287. larry January 13, 2007 8:53 am

    thanks makia i see bad stuff daily…dr.jane/you get it and are on my list…i have not yet begun the part where we interview highly credentialed alternative voices…i have managed to establish thru art the stages that lead to the ascent of this current modern toxic deadly medical hegemony…it should not surprise you that the same sort of thinkink,models and methods that all aggresive industry used have been employed….simultaneously..1)the,dialectic…..we must protect you from the evil doer frauds2)theocracy.those non believers must be eliminated for the benefit of the masses3)corpratism4)legal sanctions to protect the hegemony from attack5)ministers..MD’s,that are fully indoctrinated into the theocratic formula and doctrin6)media/marketing to dumb and numb the masses to common sense…….same formula that has been used on evryother industry we consume from…eg/agrriculture…poisens are good with your corn they increase yielsds and prevent starvation..embrase and pray to god for the miracle of fungicide,pesticide,herbicide,rodecide.with your wheaties you ingrate!

  288. bp January 13, 2007 8:54 am

    hm, kastor if you have time check this article - might help you see how the “resource wars” affect people on both sides of the issue - http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2007/02/junger200702?currentPage=1

    always amazes me how people identify the criticism of Pres Bush with criticizing the military

  289. kastor January 13, 2007 11:01 am

    Resource wars are as old as modern man. I personally think we Americans should be paying somewhere between five and eight dollars per gallon of gasoline and oil should be priced at 100-125 bucks per gallon. high market prices in a society that makes decisions dependent upon how it is marketed to is the only way to create some demand destruction. I would love to ride my bike everywhere, every nice day, problem is it is just too unsafe due to all the traffic. I would love to see us turn into more of a bicycle society as many Eastern nations have been for past decades. I’d love to see us become more of a minimalist society instead of a place where developers build Mcmansions for empty nesters. When thinking about and discussing war and the reasons for war, I applaud those who take the moral highground against all war, no matter what, as long as they are true to their convictions and consistent. Unfortunately war is as much a part of mankinds makeup as is drinking water. There are as many reasons and possible conspiracies for anything we do as a nation or as a coalition that sooner or later one has to cut through the arguments and words and look at it from a gut level regardless of initial reasons for going to war. The fact is that the USA has made many practical and moral mistakes around the world especially in the middle east. We are there, we are trying to help a nation establish a system where the people have more representation in their government. The region has never really known anything other than religious dictatorship or brutal thugs as leaders. They may not be able to drink from the cup we are offering them but, history will show that the USA spilled the blood of its sons and daughters to try and give those people a better system to live under. Some will say a representative government is not a better system to live under than a dictatorship or so called religious utopia. I will argue to the death that those of that opinion are wrong and will accept what looks like peace on the surface at any compromise. If anyone says we should leave Iraq and let the Iraqi’s work it all out amongst themselves, I say to them, why do the Iraqi people not deserve a chance at a representative type of government, where the minority is protected from the majority? You say it is impossible, well, perhaps your view is tainted by the instant gratification society you live in. Nothing is impossible and the people in that region of the world deserve a better system to live in. Doesn’t matter why we went, it matters now how we leave the place, in a shambles or with a real chance to avoid being ruled by self appointed strongarming thugs. Power corrupts and even though the USA has people who get elected and become corrupted by their power, our system allows us to toss them out. The Arab people deserve the same, don’t you think?

  290. Makia January 13, 2007 11:34 am

    kastor, thanks. I think you have a lot of good things to say there. This is Exactly what my motivation was for _almost_ enlisting in March 2003. Exactly. So i see where you are coming from.

    The biggest thing i can say to you to tell you where i’m coming from is that i think you are too on the idealistic side. And if _i’m_ telling someone that, then there’s something strange happening.

    No, the biggest thing i can say is to point out your statement

    Doesn’t matter why we went. . .

    Do you see that this is the statement of equivocation that the people who _really_ gain by war want us, who fight and suffer by it want us to beleive? In other words


    No, they don’t. We, as humans or as a socity, can try and fool ourselves into beleiving this, but it is the GREATEST mistake of spiritualty that one can make. IMO, it is the definition of spirituality. The means CREATE the end. There is no other way to it. I am not perfect as a man, but being a mature person is living with the consequences of your actions. The ENDS DO NOT JUSTIFY THE MEANS. If i can’t get away with it, then i’m not going to let the gov’t get away with it (to the extent that i can, which only extends to rhetoric at present). It’s just like the fact that i can’t run up my CC’s indefinately, or print money for that matter, but my corrupt gov’t can? That is exactly why the Constitution prohibits printing on paper and calling it “money.” The Constitution mandates that ALL MONEY BE GOLD AND SILVER. Not because it is “easy,” but because it is IMPERATIVE. Then no one can cheat, not even the gov’t, which is an IMPERATIVE check that the public has on the gov’t. But they do cheat, and the masses suffer “needlessly.” They have convinced the masses that paper money is neccesary, that THE ENDS JUSTIFY THE MEANS. But they don’t, and the poorest of the world starve while exporting their coffee and pineapples to us, who produce nothing but our own decadence. I grant you that this is simplistic, but it’s not. It is far less simplistic than your version of the United States morality police here to establish representative democracy in for the less fortuneate. The base of all of it is, is that the ends do not justify the means; and we find another coloquialism here in the straw: “You can lie to others, but you can’t lie to yourself.” Or how ’bout God? History will say what history says. But consider Vietnam. There’s what happened and then there’s the public perception of what happened. There are the results that were intended and what actually resulted. In all of that fog, the only thing that you MUST see and take into your life, and teach to others, is that you do your best and you accept the results with humility, but the means will always create the end.

  291. bp January 13, 2007 1:48 pm

    #287 kastor - thank you for that response - I feel that it was sincere and straight forward - I can’t argue with your desire for a minimalist society - like Makia I am concerned about the actions taken - to me the people who speak these high fa luting words about democracy in the Middle East speak out the side of their mouth - they only want to nullify the powers in this geopolitical area - they care nothing for the people living there - they don’t even understand the cultures there — check this discussion - our next theater of operations - Iran - http://www.moonofalabama.org/2007/01/as_glenn_greenw.html#more

  292. Rich January 13, 2007 2:22 pm

    It’s complicated.

    I’m not sure the people of Iraq or Iran really want western style democracy - kind of like the people of Venezuela really don’t want western style corporate kleptocracy.

    Problem is kastor that we in the west only allow “democracy” when it suits our needs. Arguably our elite hasn’t even allowed real democracy right here in the US (in my opinion the last two general elections are very suspect - - it ain’t who votes in modern elections, it’s who counts the vote).

    I’m an idealist at heart, so it is refreshing on some level to hear of your idealism, but cyncism took me over some time ago when I think about our corporate and political elite - - if they stay in power we are doomed, I hate to say it but I believe it - - we screwed, and frankly we need people like you to realize that and stop providing them the support they have not earned.

    Cheers Rich

  293. bp January 13, 2007 4:34 pm

    hehe #290 - Rich - I’m an idealistic realist, or is that realistic idealist - we all know how it goes with human nature, but I figure life is a slow process of maturation, hopefully we don’t destroy the Earth before Childhood’s End, don’t do as I say - do as I do - words are cheap

  294. larry January 13, 2007 6:22 pm

    288makia….fantastic logic….the government is sanctioned to do what is criminal for the common man…ect…..that was a great connection….thanks,cut thru a lot o crap there man…bingo!….great argument,run for congress!budda bing…wow!…all the PTB could do is give you an all knowing know nothing smile to that young genius!…they got no ammo against your argument…that was a zinger…290 ,289 ,291..all pointing the laser….to a place we acknowledge we need to go…now we have the admission of the crime…next,we must pursue a remedy for all the haneous crimes of man against man….not to be religious but mankind requires a phase of admission of guilt before answers are pursued…i like it…gettin somewhere…somwhere is called, we are all lost,scared and alone…..now what do we say about that ….deflaton follows inflation as crime follows fear….we have a criminal elite running the joint…SO…we…we..we..must make ‘them’ feel secure enough to get in touch with their collective fears…then they can acknowledge why they need SOOOO much to feel safe….so much power,so much money,so much adulation…their insecurity is literally KILLING US!

  295. kia January 13, 2007 6:27 pm

    The nice thing is that we all have our opinions, but there is only one set of facts ;-)


    Kastor I admire your commitment and appreciate your service to this nation. Examining the facts presented in this article and elsewhere it appears that this war has multiple objectives far beyond providing Iraqis a western style democracy.

    I am one of those who oppose war unequivocably.
    Ghandi had it right. I think that the market and rule of law are far more powerful (thankfully) and switching our support for a fair international system would go a long way toward protecting our own long term security.

    The US’s behavior in Gitmo and Abu Gharib are a perfect example of how our abuse of the world’s accepted standards (the Geneva Convention) weakens our moral influence and further imperils our security in this rapidly developing multi-polar world. If we hope to regain our security it is high time for us to relinquish our role as the bully of the world and learn to work with the other kids on the block.

    As for your personal vision, I too am a life long bicyclist and work to maintain on “small footprint” on the earth. The cosmic joke for me is that the military industrial complex is working directly against your personal vision.

    Once again thank your for your service, and point of view.

    Peace Today, Tomorrow, and the Rest of Time

  296. Rich January 13, 2007 6:32 pm

    Hey bp.

    I am a product of the western world, and as such I am destined to be a hypocrite! I preach environmentalism, but in reality I consume far more energy than the average human being on the planet. I preach peace, but I don’t fight my government for it. I preach reduced consumption but live in the west and consume like most in our society. I speak of Peak Humanity, but I have 3 kids.

    Like I said earlier, it’s complicated.

    Words are not cheap, they are free! It doesn’t cost me anything but time to say this stuff, or anyone else on this site for that matter (although Michael does have a few bills to pay to run the website!).

    I guess the only way you can discern whether people mean what they say over time is if they are consistent and seem to speak from the heart. What else is there?

    Cheers Rich

    PS. I do believe that it is easy to detect when people are lying. For instance, most of the time I’m watching Bush I can see from his eyes and body language that he’s a lying sack of potato’s! R

  297. Rich January 13, 2007 8:45 pm


    Check this out:


    Badmood Ahmadinijad and Hugo Chavez have just put $2 Billion in to a kitty to oppose Bush!

    The world gets a little more crazy each day!

    Cheers Rich

  298. kastor January 13, 2007 11:16 pm

    290, Makia, The ends do justify the means in many cases, that is just a sad fact of life in this world. There is no idealism to my method of madness. There is only one way to win hearts and minds and that is to stand by those we seek to help and show them we are willing to sacrifice for them. Call it idealistic if you want, I call it the only way to achieve what we want. The situation in history presented itself, by who, what or how, does not matter now. sadaam was in fact one of the many kingpins of the ever growing terrorism export market from that part of the world. The region has been the key to rising and falling empires for centuries. We are there, if we don’t succeed in bringing some kind of representative system to the country, a system that has limits to power, then the area will erupt. It would have erupted sooner or later regardless of our invasion of Iraq. The clock can’t be turned back, we can’t undo the invasion by pulling out. Everyone should look and think, seriously about how Central Asia and the middle east would change if we were to simply pull out and tell the Iraqi’s good luck. It is far too late for that. Like Colin Powell tried to tell Bush about the pottery barn rule, if we break it, we own it. It may have been morally wrong in some sense to initially invade, depending on your point of view but, it would be a much bigger moral dilema to pull out now. Bush may have been full of crap, though I think he believed every word he was saying, and he has certainly gotten us even more entangled in the worlds problems. There is no choice at this point except to go forward with the conviction of what war is, in essence. As MacArthur said” The very object of war is victory, not prolonged indecision.” If there were Ghandi like leaders coming to the forefront all over the place, I guess we would all be better off. The truth is there are countries and leaders in this world who want to do unto us before we do unto them. It is not all due to policies, much of it is because power corrupts and when those who seem to be gaining in power as noted by their public statements, when they think they see a weakness in an area of the world they despise, then their corruption will deepen further as they begin to poke the sleeping dog. We have reached a point in the world where pre-emption may be the only sound doctrine to keep from being poked. Support your country and the troops, no one else is. By the way, I think we should immediately take unilateral action and send troops into Darfur to help protect those people. Screw what the UN or anyone else is doing or thinks. They are suffering and we don’t need another Clintonesque failure like Rhwanda was.

  299. muleskinner January 14, 2007 7:03 am

    ‘The ends justify the means’

    Teddy Roosevelt, a real Republican, not the ersatz type that exists today (they just think they’re Republicans, they are only fooling themselves); anyhow, Teddy was once challenged to a duel by an arrogant Frenchman. The Frenchman was an excellent swordsman, Roosevelt, an excellent marksman with a rifle. Teddy responded to the stupid, thinking he was really smart Frenchman by choosing rifles for the weapons. The Marquis, an extremely poor shot, wisely declined the accepted challenge.

    The arch-conservationist trumps the cultured idiot Frenchman nitwit warrior. Didn’t matter what the arrogant fool was, French, American, Russian, whatever; he was a fool to challenge Old Four-eyes. He just happened to be a Frenchman who wanted to stay standing.

    Roosevelt didn’t flinch nor waver. He’d seen his share of fools in the past.

    Teddy Roosevelt despised violent means, he avoided confrontation at all costs.

    A bigger stick did the job.

    A stronger defense is better than a poor offense.

    “When you go to war, you go with the army you have, not the one you want.” - Donald Rumsfeld, a so-called ‘Republican’

    Sounds like a poor defense along with the poor offense.

    A Vince Lombardi he’s not.

    He’s what you call a ‘useful idiot’ now.

    The US State Department is quietly pursuing the effort to restore US ‘good will’ amongst nations. Something that has to be done.

    The so-called ‘Republicans’ have done too much damage to the US government’s foreign policy strategy for the past ten to fifteen years or so.

    It’s a shame.

    The means to their ends is suspect, maybe even malevolent (George Bush calls it ’sacrifice’).

    War is hardly the means of choice. It should have been avoided at all costs. No ‘Teddy Roosevelt Republicans’ anywhere to be seen. It wasn’t, the fools rushed in where angels fear to tread; now the price is too high.

    If that don’t beat all.

    Did George Bush lead America into temptation (lies, the means necessary)?


    Did George Bush deliver America from Evil?


    The ends don’t always justify the means.

    George Bush lead a herd of scared, stray sheep to the water so they could drink. Lead the American people into temptation, delivered them to evil.

    A Teddy Roosevelt he’s not. George Bush would have run away from that ignorant Frenchman like a scared Texas jack-rabbit. The fool such as he is.

    The ends may not be what you think they are or what you want them to be. The means used may not be able to deliver.

    The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

    You can lead a bull to the whatchamacallit, but you can’t make him stampede.

    The prices on every single item or commodity for sale in this economy is a stark testimonial of how miserably the ‘Republicans’ have failed at US domestic policy. The American citizen suffers because of their clueless, rudderless, witless, feckless leadership.

    Teddy Roosevelt is spinning in his grave.

    Had the Bush Cabal fools gone about doing their business honestly, they wouldn’t be racked by all of their troubles that they have now. Troubles foisted onto the good citizens of America, too, by the way. Americans are paying the social costs, the profits are privatized.

    It can only go on for so long before it finally goes to hell in a handbasket.


    How’s that for ya, Kastor Oil?

  300. Dr Jane Karlsson January 14, 2007 7:16 am

    Kastor #198: ‘There is only one way to win hearts and minds and that is to stand by those we seek to help and show them we are willing to sacrifice for them.’

    The problem is that this can all too easily be seen as condescension. If we don’t understand their situation, and we hardly ever do, our ’sacrifice’ turns into an insult. Self-sacrifice doesn’t work, because you are dependent on gratitude.

  301. Makia January 14, 2007 8:20 am

    kastor, i am beginning to beleive you are a shill

    i used to listen to Michael Medved, Dennis Prager, Bill Bennet, Glen Beck, etc. a lot. I’m talking like a few short months ago i listened to the stations that play these guys most of the time i was in the car, sometimes at home. i like their essentially conservative viewpoints on economic and social isseues, and even though i beleived that the U.S. reasons for being in the mid-east were duplicitous, i also beleive that there are a bunch of people who would/will attack the U.S. on our soil should we not make their life hell over there. i.e., not a big fan of the policy of appeasment. i had to stop listening to these guys when the elections drew close, because i don’t think that the R’s or the D’s, as the power institutions they are, have “our” best interest at heart. i know these radio guys feel they have a need to use their influence to advertise. “if we don’t win, they will,” but i know those guys aren’t happy with a lot of Republican activities, but they ignore their own complaints and turn into merchants. and i mean _ignore_ themselves, their own hearts. not that i know these guys personally, but i pay attention. those guys _should_ have a greater obligation toward helping the electrate understand the complex issues that they know exist, but they turn into shills. i realize since then that guys were probably shills the whole time, i just didn’t realize it as strongly. i still consider myself very much a “conservative” on all issues economic, government, and probably by many issues a social conservative as well. but the R’s vs. the D’s is just corporate welfare vs. social welare. there’s no conservativism there. that the r’s use the word to describe themselves drives me nuts. they must think people are idiots. and they obviously are. the voters who are not bought outright, in my opinion, are riduculous pawns in a ridiculous kiddy game of my team vs. the bad guys. at least people whose votes are bought can say that the ends justify the means.

    kasror, i’m glad that you’ve expressed your opinions so clearly and they sound heart-felt. live with integrity and you’ll learn valuable things that most americans don’t know. but sometimes integrity can turn into stiffness. and the stiffness in your mind will turn into stiffness in your body, and you will start to have some bigger problems in your life than whether or not Americans are criticizing their leaders.

    on the other-side of the coin, i wonder if you are just a shill. you know you are talking out of both sides of your mouth. this is exactly what i mean by “the ends do not justify the means” and exactly not what i mean about “living with integrity.”

    you said something about winning hearts and minds, it could have been done much better with a plan and follow through. to me it seems obvious that it was mostly rhetoric with a couple billion dollars thrown in for a good show. no, i don’t know how it will turn out, but i do know that the hearts and minds of the people were not a priority, and a semi-intelligent high-school history student would tell you it should have been priority #1. a house built on sand will. . .

    after all these responses to kastor’s from everyone, i think we’ve established that we’re not whiny liberals. i guess that is what i really wanted to take on. i’m more than glad that we were able to have this debate with a disagreeing point-of-view. kastor, i hope you stick around, i hope you realize that we all have pretty decent reasons for picking up our ideaologies and its nothing to to with class warfare or blame-america-first. we’re no idiots in here.

    and kastor, i hope you are being honest with us, i mostly beleive that you are, but you have disagreed outright with some very good points made by posters here. without any acknowledgement from you that there may be a good point being made, even if you disagree. i notice that everyone here has granted you that. if you did a little give-and-take kind of thing like that, maybe you’d have a little more of the influence over our hearts and minds that would help your POV. but reading your posts i can’t help but wonder if you’re just a well-thought-out but misguided shill, working to establish a point-of-view that you know is two-sided while you act like it isn’t, and in that case you’ll have to live with yourself.

    the ends will never justify the means

    another way of saying

    live like there’s no tomorrow, because maybe there isn’t

    another way of saying:

    prepare, for you know not when the master cometh

    and on and on my friend. i didn’t make this stuff up, and neither did some blame-america-first-bush-hater


  302. Makia January 14, 2007 8:24 am

    also, larry, p#288 wasn’t mine, but i appreciate your compliment of telling me i should run for senate.

    were you drunk?

    love, all

  303. bp January 14, 2007 8:55 am

    hm, kastor, I feel like we have beat you up - I admire you for sticking to your guns - these are trying times - from my point of view we as a nation are going thru a transition - having to learn that “might does not make right” - force is not an acceptable solution to problems - as long as the president is supported by people that believe force is better than cooperation our troops will continue to get ground down - we are in a new type of warfare - no longer nation against nation, and we need to learn that new strategies are required - until then I will be cynical and believe that the people in the military who are getting chewed up are ones that chose to be there - until they turn on the president I don’t have much hope for them getting out of the military alive - in the long run this will destroy our military - it is wearing out - personnel and equipment - such a sad lesson to learn

  304. kia January 14, 2007 10:48 am

    Makia (#301)

    They don’t call it “programming” for nothing, maybe kastor is another helpless shill like his President. ;-)

  305. larry January 14, 2007 2:28 pm

    makia…good idea…i avoid drinking….i’ll just hook up a central line and go direct I.V…….anyways your thinking was great….war is in the wind i am afraid…it is what it is,eh….where did the STRANGER vanish to?…we are all trapped in the greatest game…russian roulette on a global scale….yeeha!….dr. stranglove lives on

  306. Dr Jane Karlsson January 15, 2007 3:38 am

    Makia #301, you are confusing me. You believe ‘there are a bunch of people who would/will attack the US on our soil should we not make their life hell over there’ … who are these people?

  307. Rich January 15, 2007 6:57 am

    Hey Jane.

    Over here in the US the incessant propaganda says something like “we have to fight them in Iraq because if we don’t they will fight us over here.” It’s pretty twisted logic, and implies that the Christian leadership believes it is morally defensible to attract all of the berserkers in to Iraq to slaughter Iraqi’s while professing to being there in order to bring them democracy and freedom!!

    This kind of logic works well on the republican core base of support in the hinterlands. No one seems capable of seeing through the inherent logic and moral traps built in to the theory.

    Cheers Rich

  308. Administrator January 15, 2007 7:46 am

    Dear Friends,

    My apologies for having neglected the thread for so long. As some of you know, I was on vacation for the first 10 days of the year, in France. There are some nice pictures from my wife’s blog: http://tw.myblog.yahoo.com/boston-traveler/ (and description, too, for anyone who reads Mandarin!)

    Happy MLK day. Be happy u r free…

    I’ve been paying attention to the direction of the thread, and put up some food for thought, which should make for excellent continuation for the discussion:

    A New American Dark Age

    Let us continue the thread at the new post:

    Best regards to all!

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